aroid hybrid

From: Tony Avent <tony at plantdelights.com> on 2009.08.09 at 17:44:12(19670) Aroiders: Has anyone had experiences with Pinellia hybridizing with Sauromatum? I know all my taxonomist friends are either reaching for a stiff drink or headache medicine at the thought of such a hybrid. I'm not even sure if this is even theoretically possible, but to be sure, we never let our plants read genetics books. Take a look at our hybrid of Pinellia pedatisecta and Sauromatum venosum. The height is 2' tall and, the leaves are intermediate between the two parents. The plant produces sauromatum like speckled petioles, but with many emerging per corm (sauromatum only produces one each) like the pinellia parent. I missed the flower this year, but will watch closer next year. I'd like to hear your thoughts. http://www.plantdelights.com/gallery/Aroids -- Tony Avent +More Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least three times" - Avent _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: "J. Agoston" <agoston.janos123 at gmail.com> on 2009.08.10 at 06:21:52(19675) Dear Tony, I have experienced Sauromatum with 2 leaves, and maybe seedlings can have even more leaves when they are in growth (I'm not sure, I have never raised Sauromatum from seeds), anyway very interesting plant. Good luck! If this Pinellia × Sauromatum hybrid is true you are writnig history! Bye, Jan HTML +More Z5a, Hungary --001636b2ae6b0d56d30470c39a89----==============‘67677500236773007=

From: Peter Boyce <phymatarum at googlemail.com> on 2009.08.10 at 07:04:05(19677) Tony, Ah! The wonders of photoshop! Looks VERY convincing. Joking aside, I think we aroid folks tend to think that 'our' plants don't get up to such hedonistic sexual activities as 'other' groups, and thus remain pure. While aroids in the wild do indeed very rarely hybridize the evidence we have here in Asia is that is not so much a matter of pollen incompatibility but rather niche partitioning, with different species utilizing different guilds of pollinators (e.g., diurnal beetles; crepuscular beetles; nocturnal beetles, etc.). Cheers Peter +More -----Original Message----- From: aroid-l-bounces@gizmoworks.com [mailto:aroid-l-bounces@gizmoworks.com] On Behalf Of Tony Avent Sent: 10 August 2009 01:44 To: Aroid - L group Subject: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid Aroiders: Has anyone had experiences with Pinellia hybridizing with Sauromatum? I know all my taxonomist friends are either reaching for a stiff drink or headache medicine at the thought of such a hybrid. I'm not even sure if this is even theoretically possible, but to be sure, we never let our plants read genetics books. Take a look at our hybrid of Pinellia pedatisecta and Sauromatum venosum. The height is 2' tall and, the leaves are intermediate between the two parents. The plant produces sauromatum like speckled petioles, but with many emerging per corm (sauromatum only produces one each) like the pinellia parent. I missed the flower this year, but will watch closer next year. I'd like to hear your thoughts. http://www.plantdelights.com/gallery/Aroids -- Tony Avent Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least three times" - Avent _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: Brian Williams <pugturd at windstream.net> on 2009.08.10 at 14:11:25(19681) Tony very interesting to hear this. I would have never thought that that cross would have been possible. Was this hybrid done at the nursery or was the plants found in the wild? Personally I find this info extremely exciting and interesting. I am sure others are feeling a bit sick or whipping tears from their face. Either way I am sure we would all be interested in seeing a flower of such a cross. Thanks. +More _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: Don Martinson <LLmen at wi.rr.com> on 2009.08.10 at 14:29:32(19683) Will be very interesting to see the flower. My only hope is that the hybrid is not as prolific as P. pedatisecta, whose seeds seem to have a germination rate of 110% and seem intent upon taking over my garden. I have had a Saoromatum survive once over a relatively mild winter here, so perhaps if this is a true hybrid, it will be a little less invasive. Don Martinson +More Milwaukee, Wisconsin Mailto:llmen@wi.rr.com On 8/9/09 12:44 PM, "Tony Avent" wrote: > Aroiders: > > Has anyone had experiences with Pinellia hybridizing with Sauromatum? > I know all my taxonomist friends are either reaching for a stiff drink > or headache medicine at the thought of such a hybrid. I'm not even sure > if this is even theoretically possible, but to be sure, we never let our > plants read genetics books. Take a look at our hybrid of Pinellia > pedatisecta and Sauromatum venosum. The height is 2' tall and, the > leaves are intermediate between the two parents. The plant produces > sauromatum like speckled petioles, but with many emerging per corm > (sauromatum only produces one each) like the pinellia parent. I missed > the flower this year, but will watch closer next year. I'd like to hear > your thoughts. http://www.plantdelights.com/gallery/Aroids _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: "Marek Argent" <abri1973 at wp.pl> on 2009.08.10 at 19:32:06(19686) Incredible! You've successfully made an intergeneric cross. Now let's think about the new genus name according to the botanical nomenclature. I suggest: × Sauronellia (if the genus Sauromatum will be back) or ×Typhonellia if venosum will stay in Typhonium. What do you think? Marek +More ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Avent" To: "Aroid - L group" Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2009 7:44 PM Subject: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid > Aroiders: > > Has anyone had experiences with Pinellia hybridizing with Sauromatum? > I know all my taxonomist friends are either reaching for a stiff drink > or headache medicine at the thought of such a hybrid. I'm not even sure > if this is even theoretically possible, but to be sure, we never let our > plants read genetics books. Take a look at our hybrid of Pinellia > pedatisecta and Sauromatum venosum. The height is 2' tall and, the > leaves are intermediate between the two parents. The plant produces > sauromatum like speckled petioles, but with many emerging per corm > (sauromatum only produces one each) like the pinellia parent. I missed > the flower this year, but will watch closer next year. I'd like to hear > your thoughts. http://www.plantdelights.com/gallery/Aroids > > -- > Tony Avent > Plant Delights Nursery @ > Juniper Level Botanic Garden > 9241 Sauls Road > Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA > Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F > Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F > USDA Hardiness Zone 7b > email tony@plantdelights.com > website http://www.plantdelights.com > phone 919 772-4794 > fax 919 772-4752 > "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least > three times" - Avent > > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l > _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: "Tony Avent" <tony at plantdelights.com> on 2009.08.11 at 11:26:38(19690) Aroiders: Thanks for the comments on our possible hybrid. As for juvenility, the hybrid is over 4 years old...notice that it's already formed mature offsets. +More We also have a block of 6 year old Sauromatum from seed and none ever produced multiple petioles. This plant popped up in our garden and was not an intentional cross...wish I could take credit for the cross. It is large enough to have been flowering for at least two years, but there are no sign of any nearby seedlings and with such a wide cross, I would anticipate sterility. It does not seem to flower through the summer as does pinellia, so I'm assuming that it is a spring born flower...have relocated it to a location where I won't miss it next year. Since the cross was closest to the pinellia parent, I would assume the pinellia to be the maternal parent, making it a x Pinelamatum. Now if we can make the reciprocal cross, perhaps that could use x Sauronelia. > Incredible! > > You've successfully made an intergeneric cross. > Now let's think about the new genus name according to the botanical > nomenclature. > I suggest: > × Sauronellia (if the genus Sauromatum will be back) or ×Typhonellia if > venosum will stay in Typhonium. > What do you think? > > Marek > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tony Avent" > To: "Aroid - L group" > Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2009 7:44 PM > Subject: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid > > >> Aroiders: >> >> Has anyone had experiences with Pinellia hybridizing with Sauromatum? >> I know all my taxonomist friends are either reaching for a stiff drink >> or headache medicine at the thought of such a hybrid. I'm not even sure >> if this is even theoretically possible, but to be sure, we never let our >> plants read genetics books. Take a look at our hybrid of Pinellia >> pedatisecta and Sauromatum venosum. The height is 2' tall and, the >> leaves are intermediate between the two parents. The plant produces >> sauromatum like speckled petioles, but with many emerging per corm >> (sauromatum only produces one each) like the pinellia parent. I missed >> the flower this year, but will watch closer next year. I'd like to hear >> your thoughts. http://www.plantdelights.com/gallery/Aroids >> >> -- >> Tony Avent >> Plant Delights Nursery @ >> Juniper Level Botanic Garden >> 9241 Sauls Road >> Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA >> Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F >> Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F >> USDA Hardiness Zone 7b >> email tony@plantdelights.com >> website http://www.plantdelights.com >> phone 919 772-4794 >> fax 919 772-4752 >> "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least >> three times" - Avent >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Aroid-L mailing list >> Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com >> http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l >> > > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l > Tony Avent USDA Zone 7b, (0-10F winter, 90-100F Summer) Plant Delights Nursery 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, NC 27603, USA ph 919.772.4794 fx 919.772.4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I've killed it myself...at least three times." - Avent _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: "Marek Argent" <abri1973 at wp.pl> on 2009.08.11 at 11:43:45(19692) Hi Jan, Sauromatum/Typhonium venosum even with 3 leaves is nothing strange. If the growth period is long and good conditions, it can look like this: http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/typhonium/typh2.htm Marek HTML +More ----- Original Message ----- From: J. Agoston To: Discussion of aroids Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 8:21 AM Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid Dear Tony, I have experienced Sauromatum with 2 leaves, and maybe seedlings can have even more leaves when they are in growth (I'm not sure, I have never raised Sauromatum from seeds), anyway very interesting plant. Good luck! If this Pinellia × Sauromatum hybrid is true you are writnig history! Bye, Jan Z5a, Hungary _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l ------=_NextPart_000_005A_01CA1A89.BFA0D230----==============d62325875507183095=

From: "plantguy at zoominternet.net" <plantguy at zoominternet.net> on 2009.08.12 at 11:14:05(19699) I would have to agree that I have dug up many tubers of T. venosum with multiple petioles after a good growing season so this is not deterministic. It will be interesting to see the influorescence next year. I'm not a fan of crosses in general, but an intergeneric is exciting if true :o) Dan Original Message: +More ----------------- From: Marek Argent abri1973@wp.pl Date: Tue, 11 Aug 2009 13:43:45 +0200 To: aroid-l@gizmoworks.com Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid Hi Jan, Sauromatum/Typhonium venosum even with 3 leaves is nothing strange. If the growth period is long and good conditions, it can look like this: http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/typhonium/typh2.htm Marek ----- Original Message ----- From: J. Agoston To: Discussion of aroids Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 8:21 AM Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid Dear Tony, I have experienced Sauromatum with 2 leaves, and maybe seedlings can have even more leaves when they are in growth (I'm not sure, I have never raised Sauromatum from seeds), anyway very interesting plant. Good luck! If this Pinellia × Sauromatum hybrid is true you are writnig history! Bye, Jan Z5a, Hungary ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://link.mail2web.com/mail2web _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: bonaventure at optonline.net on 2009.08.12 at 15:55:39(19701) Tony, looks like small Sauromatums grown in some combination of lower light, richer soil, crowding. My venosum "volunteers" regularly produce multiple leaf stems. I'd wait till I see the flowers for sure. Can't seem to get rid of Pinellia pedatisecta here either...hmmm...maybe I've got hybrid offspring getting ready to take over Cliffwood Beach!   Bonaventure Magrys NJ   Incredible! You've successfully made an intergeneric cross. Now let's think about the new genus name according to the botanical nomenclature. HTML +More I suggest: × Sauronellia (if the genus Sauromatum will be back) or ×Typhonellia if venosum will stay in Typhonium. What do you think? Marek ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Avent" <tony@plantdelights.com> To: "Aroid - L group" <aroid-l@gizmoworks.com> Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2009 7:44 PM Subject: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid > Aroiders: > > Has anyone had experiences with Pinellia hybridizing with Sauromatum? > I know all my taxonomist friends are either reaching for a stiff drink > or headache medicine at the thought of such a hybrid.  I'm not even sure > if this is even theoretically possible, but to be sure, we never let our > plants read genetics books.   Take a look at our hybrid of Pinellia > pedatisecta and Sauromatum venosum.  The height is 2' tall and, the > leaves are intermediate between the two parents.  The plant produces > sauromatum like speckled petioles, but with many emerging per corm > (sauromatum only produces one each) like the pinellia parent.  I missed > the flower this year, but will watch closer next year.  I'd like to hear > your thoughts.  http://www.plantdelights.com/gallery/Aroids > > -- > Tony Avent > Plant Delights Nursery @ > Juniper Level Botanic Garden > 9241 Sauls Road > Raleigh, North Carolina  27603  USA > Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F > Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F > USDA Hardiness Zone 7b > email tony@plantdelights.com --Boundary_(ID_YMIGs8T0d6MjCKKCDX31mA)----=============='53177210172720427=

From: "Marek Argent" <abri1973 at wp.pl> on 2009.08.12 at 17:45:31(19705) Hello, I think my suggestions are more elegant and easy to remember. Anyway, I don't remember all the rules of intergeneric hybrid nomenclature, Should the mother plant be first, does it matter? In Orchidaceae there are names composed from 3 parent plants like Brassolaeliocattleya, and I don't know if it is important from which genus the seeds were collected. Marek +More ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Avent" To: "Discussion of aroids" Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 1:26 PM Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid Aroiders: Thanks for the comments on our possible hybrid. As for juvenility, the hybrid is over 4 years old...notice that it's already formed mature offsets. We also have a block of 6 year old Sauromatum from seed and none ever produced multiple petioles. This plant popped up in our garden and was not an intentional cross...wish I could take credit for the cross. It is large enough to have been flowering for at least two years, but there are no sign of any nearby seedlings and with such a wide cross, I would anticipate sterility. It does not seem to flower through the summer as does pinellia, so I'm assuming that it is a spring born flower...have relocated it to a location where I won't miss it next year. Since the cross was closest to the pinellia parent, I would assume the pinellia to be the maternal parent, making it a x Pinelamatum. Now if we can make the reciprocal cross, perhaps that could use x Sauronelia. > Incredible! > > You've successfully made an intergeneric cross. > Now let's think about the new genus name according to the botanical > nomenclature. > I suggest: > × Sauronellia (if the genus Sauromatum will be back) or ×Typhonellia if > venosum will stay in Typhonium. > What do you think? > > Marek > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tony Avent" > To: "Aroid - L group" > Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2009 7:44 PM > Subject: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid > > >> Aroiders: >> >> Has anyone had experiences with Pinellia hybridizing with Sauromatum? >> I know all my taxonomist friends are either reaching for a stiff drink >> or headache medicine at the thought of such a hybrid. I'm not even sure >> if this is even theoretically possible, but to be sure, we never let our >> plants read genetics books. Take a look at our hybrid of Pinellia >> pedatisecta and Sauromatum venosum. The height is 2' tall and, the >> leaves are intermediate between the two parents. The plant produces >> sauromatum like speckled petioles, but with many emerging per corm >> (sauromatum only produces one each) like the pinellia parent. I missed >> the flower this year, but will watch closer next year. I'd like to hear >> your thoughts. http://www.plantdelights.com/gallery/Aroids >> >> -- >> Tony Avent >> Plant Delights Nursery @ >> Juniper Level Botanic Garden >> 9241 Sauls Road >> Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA >> Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F >> Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F >> USDA Hardiness Zone 7b >> email tony@plantdelights.com >> website http://www.plantdelights.com >> phone 919 772-4794 >> fax 919 772-4752 >> "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least >> three times" - Avent >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Aroid-L mailing list >> Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com >> http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l >> > > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l > Tony Avent USDA Zone 7b, (0-10F winter, 90-100F Summer) Plant Delights Nursery 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, NC 27603, USA ph 919.772.4794 fx 919.772.4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I've killed it myself...at least three times." - Avent _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: Tony Avent <tony at plantdelights.com> on 2009.08.12 at 19:00:09(19707) Marek: The Code doesn't specify which parent comes first in the name of a bigeneric hybrid, but the standard in all breeding is to put the maternal parent first. Tony Avent +More Plant Delights Nursery @ Juniper Level Botanic Garden 9241 Sauls Road Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F USDA Hardiness Zone 7b email tony@plantdelights.com website http://www.plantdelights.com phone 919 772-4794 fax 919 772-4752 "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least thre e times" - Avent Marek Argent wrote: > Hello, > > I think my suggestions are more elegant and easy to remember. > Anyway, I don't remember all the rules of intergeneric hybrid nomenclatur e, > Should the mother plant be first, does it matter? > In Orchidaceae there are names composed from 3 parent plants like > Brassolaeliocattleya, > and I don't know if it is important from which genus the seeds were > collected. > > Marek > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tony Avent" > To: "Discussion of aroids" > Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 1:26 PM > Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid > > > Aroiders: > > Thanks for the comments on our possible hybrid. As for juvenility, the > hybrid is over 4 years old...notice that it's already formed mature > offsets. > We also have a block of 6 year old Sauromatum from seed and none ever > produced multiple petioles. This plant popped up in our garden and was > not an intentional cross...wish I could take credit for the cross. It is > large enough to have been flowering for at least two years, but there are > no sign of any nearby seedlings and with such a wide cross, I would > anticipate sterility. It does not seem to flower through the summer as > does pinellia, so I'm assuming that it is a spring born flower...have > relocated it to a location where I won't miss it next year. Since the > cross was closest to the pinellia parent, I would assume the pinellia to > be the maternal parent, making it a x Pinelamatum. Now if we can make the > reciprocal cross, perhaps that could use x Sauronelia. > > >> Incredible! >> >> You've successfully made an intergeneric cross. >> Now let's think about the new genus name according to the botanical >> nomenclature. >> I suggest: >> × Sauronellia (if the genus Sauromatum will be back) or ×Typhonellia if >> venosum will stay in Typhonium. >> What do you think? >> >> Marek >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Tony Avent" >> To: "Aroid - L group" >> Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2009 7:44 PM >> Subject: [Aroid-l] aroid hybrid >> >> >> >>> Aroiders: >>> >>> Has anyone had experiences with Pinellia hybridizing with Sauromatum? >>> I know all my taxonomist friends are either reaching for a stiff drink >>> or headache medicine at the thought of such a hybrid. I'm not even sure >>> if this is even theoretically possible, but to be sure, we never let our >>> plants read genetics books. Take a look at our hybrid of Pinellia >>> pedatisecta and Sauromatum venosum. The height is 2' tall and, the >>> leaves are intermediate between the two parents. The plant produces >>> sauromatum like speckled petioles, but with many emerging per corm >>> (sauromatum only produces one each) like the pinellia parent. I missed >>> the flower this year, but will watch closer next year. I'd like to hear >>> your thoughts. http://www.plantdelights.com/gallery/Aroids >>> >>> -- >>> Tony Avent >>> Plant Delights Nursery @ >>> Juniper Level Botanic Garden >>> 9241 Sauls Road >>> Raleigh, North Carolina 27603 USA >>> Minimum Winter Temps 0-5 F >>> Maximum Summer Temps 95-105F >>> USDA Hardiness Zone 7b >>> email tony@plantdelights.com >>> website http://www.plantdelights.com >>> phone 919 772-4794 >>> fax 919 772-4752 >>> "I consider every plant hardy until I have killed it myself...at least >>> three times" - Avent >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Aroid-L mailing list >>> Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com >>> http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Aroid-L mailing list >> Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com >> http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l >> >> > > > Tony Avent > USDA Zone 7b, (0-10F winter, 90-100F Summer) > Plant Delights Nursery > 9241 Sauls Road > Raleigh, NC 27603, USA > ph 919.772.4794 > fx 919.772.4752 > > "I consider every plant hardy until I've killed it myself...at least three > times." - Avent > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l > > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l > _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L@www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

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