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 This is a continuously updated archive of the Aroid-L mailing list in a forum format - not an actual Forum. If you want to post, you will still need to register for the Aroid-L mailing list and send your postings by e-mail for moderation in the normal way.

  native North American aroids
From: jbauer at concordnc.com on 1999.12.06 at 15:23:54(3894)
Could anyone help?
I need a list of any native North American aroids.
Thanks,
Judy Bauer
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From: "Bonaventure W Magrys" magrysbo at shu.edu> on 1999.12.08 at 04:00:17(3898)
Judy writes:
Could anyone help?
I need a list of any native North American aroids.
Thanks,
Judy Bauer
8440 Huckleberry Trail
Concord NC 28027
US plant zone 7

So far Judy, of the temperate non-aquatic aroids, I know of Arisaema triphyllum
(in several varieties), stewardsonii (which I have grown and bloomed, and
appears very different from triphyllum) and draconteum. The skunk cabbages,
Lyso-something or other, have at least one eastern and one pacific northwestern
member. This is what all I know of right now and hope that other members of our
organization can add to our knowledge.
Bonaventure W. Magrys

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From: Aloe1023 at aol.com on 1999.12.08 at 16:36:56(3899)
According to Deni Bown's book, Orontium aquaticum comes from eastern North
America, called the Golden Club. This is aquatic though.

Semi-aquatic Lysichiton americanus, Skunk Cabbage,from western North America
from Alaska to Calif.

Symplocarpus foetidus, Eastern Skunk Cabbage, Collard, Meadow Cabbage,
Polecate Weed, and Swamp Cabbage; from eastern North Am.

Peltandra virginica, Arrow Arum, eastern North Am. Two other species.

This is all I could find, hope it helps.
Russ.

From: "Julius Boos" ju-bo at email.msn.com> on 1999.12.08 at 16:41:16(3900)
Dear Judy,
As I recall at this moment there are the two species of Peltandra--P.
virginica and P. sagittifolia, Orontium aquaticum, Lysichiton americanus,
Symplocarpus foetidus, Calla palustris, Pista stratiotes, Arisaema with a
couple of species, and MANY introduced genera, i.e. Xanthosoma, Colocasia,
Alocasia, Arum, Dieffenbachia, Caladium, Syngonium, Philodendron,
Epipremnum, etc.. Hope this helps. If you have specific questions
perhaps about Aroids in a specific state, post again.
Cheers,
Julius

From: Dean Sliger deanslgr at kode.net> on 1999.12.08 at 16:47:14(3902)
Lysichiton americanus (Western Skunk Cabbage), Symplocarpus foetidus (Eastern Skunk
Cabbage). Also Orontium aquaticum (Golden Club) and Peltandra virginica (Arrow
Arum). Calla palustris (Water Arum) is found in North America but I'm not sure if
it's native here; listed as "temperate regions of NA, Europe and Asia." I suppose
too much scrutiny could start a "What is 'native'?" debate. ;-)

Dean Sliger

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From: "C. R. Waldron" cwaldron at frognet.net> on 1999.12.08 at 16:50:12(3903)
"Lyso-something" is Lysichiton americanus, the westernk skunk =
cabbage--the eastern one is Symplocarpus foetidus. Add to the list =
Peltandra virginica (arrow arum), Calla palustris, Orontium aquaticum =
(golden club), and now the various "duck weeds" (Lemnaceae) including =
Spriodela, Lemna, Wolfiella and Wolffia. Arisaema "draconteum" should =
be dracontium (green dragon).

Clarence

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From: Aloe1023 at aol.com on 1999.12.09 at 03:10:08(3904)
Howdy. I didn't list Pistia stratioides because I thought it was naturalized
here, brought from Africa and India. The list would also be endless of minor
Aroid escapes in south Florida.
Russ

From: Aloe1023 at aol.com on 1999.12.09 at 03:14:02(3905)

Are the Lemnaceae now officially considered Aroids??
Russ

From: Iza & Carol Goroff goroff at idcnet.com> on 1999.12.09 at 03:17:31(3906)
Calla pallustris is native to the Beaulah Bog in Walworth County, SE Wisconsin.

Iza Goroff

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From: "Julius Boos" ju-bo at email.msn.com> on 1999.12.09 at 15:01:40(3909)
>Howdy. I didn't list Pistia stratioides because I thought it was
naturalized
here, brought from Africa and India. The list would also be endless of
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From: Aloe1023 at aol.com on 1999.12.09 at 16:35:51(3910)
Thank you Julius. Yes, Deni Bown's book didn't seem too specific as to
exactly
where Pistia came from or when. And obviously it is NOT a 'minor' escape here
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From: rmchatton rmchatton at photocircuits.com> on 1999.12.09 at 16:40:55(3911)
Just to throw in my two-cents worth so to speak: It is possible that
Pistia stratioides originated in Asia or Africa and migrated to South
America without the involvement of man. There are at least two species of
orchids which have managed this feat fairly recently. The most well
documented of these is Oeceoclades maculata which is "native" to the west
coast of Africa in the general area where Africa and South America are
"close" together. In that habitat, the species grows terrestrially in
sandy environments. The species appeared in South America (localized to
coastal environments) and the islands of the Carribean immediately
following an atmospheric event which resulted is large quantities of red
dust being blown from the African continent and deposited in these areas.
The species has a strong tendency to self-pollinate so seed production is
prolific. Since that time, this species has colonized a fairly substantial
area of northern South America, the Carribean islands, most of Florida and
the gulf coastal states where the winter temperatures don't get cold enough
to freeze the ground. There is also a species of Bulbophyllum which has
apparently managed the migration (the only african member of an otherwise
asian orchid genus). If orchids can do, its not hard to imagine aroids
managing the same feat.

Ron McHatton

From: StellrJ at aol.com on 1999.12.09 at 21:02:30(3912)
In a message dated 12/09/1999 8:41:05 AM Pacific Standard Time,
rmchatton@photocircuits.com writes:

> Since that time, this species has colonized a fairly substantial

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From: StellrJ at aol.com on 1999.12.09 at 21:06:53(3913)
In a message dated 12/08/1999 8:47:06 AM Pacific Standard Time,
deanslgr@kode.net writes:

> Calla palustris (Water Arum) is found in North America but I'm not sure if

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From: Lewandjim at aol.com on 1999.12.09 at 21:09:57(3914)
In a message dated 12/09/1999 11:40:48 AM Eastern Standard Time,
rmchatton@photocircuits.com writes:

<< Just to throw in my two-cents worth so to speak: It is possible that

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From: Lester Kallus lkallus at earthlink.net> on 1999.12.09 at 23:12:54(3916)
Those of you in Florida will probably have a good laugh when you learn that they charge us between $3 and $5 for Pistia here on Long Island. The same holds true for water hyacinths.

These tolerate our ponds for the summer and then roll over dead at the first sign of cold weather.

You'll laugh further still to hear that I'm keeping one Pistia alive in my kitchen so that I can save a couple bucks next summer (plus it's a souvenir of a Florida trip anyway).

Les

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From: Bob Burns bobburns61 at yahoo.com> on 1999.12.10 at 15:07:34(3918)
here are the native aroids, as I understand them:
Calla palustris, in the far north.
Symplocarpus foetidus, in the East.
Acorus calamus, in wet spots wherever.
Arisaema triphyllum; some writers divide this in
two or three species; Eastern.
Arisaema dracontium, also Eastern.
Orontium aquaticum, mostly SE
Peltandra virginica, Eastern.
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From: Eric.Schmidt at ci.orlando.fl.us (Eric Schmidt) on 1999.12.10 at 19:27:31(3921)
Ones that I have seen naturalised in Central Florida;

Colocasia esculenta
Xanthosoma sagittifolium
Alocasia macrorrhiza
Syngonium podophyllum
Epipremnum aureum

Eric Schmidt

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From: "Julius Boos" ju-bo at email.msn.com> on 1999.12.12 at 07:26:48(3923)
Dear Bob,
I believe that at preasent Acorus is no longer considered an Aroid!! There
are two species of this in N. America, one native (I believe it is C.
americanus) and the other C.palustris, is introduced.
There are Arum species established and doing well in several Western States,
and several species of Xanthosoma, Colocasia, plus other Aroids well
established and doing well here in S. Florida.!!
Cheers,
Julius

From: plantnut at macconnect.com (Dewey) on 1999.12.12 at 20:50:34(3929)
Lester,
When the person sells you Pistia.... He/She is breaking the law....
Pistia is on the Federal Noxious Weed List and is against the law to sell
or distribute it.... It is not against the law to have it but is... to
sell....
Dewey

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From: Lester Kallus lkallus at earthlink.net> on 1999.12.13 at 14:43:41(3934)
Are you sure that the law applies in areas where it can't possibly survive over the winter? It's not just one place that sells it - it's almost all places that sell pond plants -- at least it was widely available 2 summers ago. This past summer I never looked so can't guarantee it was around. Large plants sold for even more than the previously quoted $3-$5!

Are water hyacinths on that list too? Those too are available for sale here yet I know they clog southern waterways.

Les

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From: SelbyHort at aol.com on 1999.12.14 at 14:58:19(3946)
Les,

Pistia stratiodes is a prohibited aquatic invasive under regulation by the
Florida Department of Environmental Protection (DEP). Water Hyacinth
(Echhornia spp.) is also prohibited by the DEP. It is illegal (punishable as
a 2nd degree misdemeanor) to cultivate, *collect* (watch out Les), possess,
transport, sell or import these species, or any others prohibited by DEP,
within the state of Florida unless you have a special permit issued by the
DEP. Unlike water hyacinth, which is a Class I prohibited plant, Pista is
Class II prohibited, and can be legally propagated by nurseries within the
state of Florida and transported out of state for sale if the nursery is
regulated by the FL Dept of Agriculture and Consumer Affairs. Non-commercial
(homeowner) cultivation is prohibited...you can't get a permit to grow this
in your fish pond at home in Florida, folks. Therefore, nurseries in other
regions can obtain Florida grown Pistia legally if the nursery in FL is
permitted to handle this plant. I don't know if these species are regulated
at the national level as noxious weeds (someone could check the USDA web site
and report back to aroid-l). Individual states in zones where these plants
are causing trouble may have their own laws that might be more stringent than
the Federal laws.

Maybe I have this all wrong, but I think I am looking at the most recent DEP
rules. Someone please correct me if I am wrong. Of course, its entirely
possible that the USDA rules contradict the FL DEP.

This whole issue gets really complex once you realize that one must sort
through many different lists that carry the weight of law compiled by the
various government authorities at the the international, national, state and
local level. Each branch of government has its own set of criteria for
determining the status of potential invasives, and some of these lists
contradict each other once you start getting into it. Lists are also revised
periodically, meaning you have to stay on top of all this mess. Makes things
difficult to comprehend, much less comply with.

The whole issue of invasives is a difficult one. I'm sure someone could spend
a lifetime trying to unravel all the government issued regulations and make
some sense of it all. Invasive plants will continue to reproduce and spread
faster than our ability to regulate them.

Donna Atwood
Selby Gardens

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From: Lester Kallus lkallus at earthlink.net> on 1999.12.15 at 14:46:47(3951)
Donna, thanks for the explanation. What you're implying by this is that
the New York garden centers are within their rights selling these plants
(despite their obscene profit margin) where they can't possibly survive a
winter but that I might end up in jail for the pistia I brought back from
a Florida pond.

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From: StellrJ at aol.com on 1999.12.15 at 14:52:48(3953)
I am a little confused, because you mention Acorus, but then you abbreviate
it C.

In a message dated 12/11/1999 11:26:45 PM Pacific Standard Time,

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From: SelbyHort at aol.com on 1999.12.16 at 16:38:38(3960)
Les,
Yes, you have quite adequately assessed the situation. The government would
never think of limiting any commercial operation's profits, so we sure know
who is being served here, don't we?
Donna

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From: "Julius Boos" ju-bo at email.msn.com> on 1999.12.16 at 16:44:38(3962)
>I am a little confused, because you mention Acorus, but then you abbreviate
it C.>

Dear Jason,
Sorry, I meant to type 'Acorus calamus', NOT 'C' (Calla!) palustris! Am
trying to do too many things all at once, and messed up. Dr. Sue Thompson
gave an excellent lecture on these at MOBOT earlier this year, that is where
I got the info on these two species, one native and used by the Native
Indians, the other introduced.
Cheers,
Julius

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From: "Julius Boos" ju-bo at email.msn.com> on 1999.12.16 at 16:47:40(3963)
Hello all Aroid Friends,
Has anyone heard or has information on the following---I have heard that the
USDA has deemed Colocasia AND CALADIUM 'bad' genera and has/will ban their
import starting next May?? This has been bantered around here in Florida
for a while, a T`dadian friend was trying to import eddoes a couple of years
ago, and the growers here in Florida made the USDA stop him importing,
claiming it hurt their buisness, and that it may introduce pests. Then I
heard they were working on banning the import of all Colocasia and
Caladiums, and just this week I heard that it has passed and will be
implemented early next year!
This is BAD news IF it is true, and I wonder if anyone can confirm it, and
if anything can now be done to 'fight' it?
Cheers,
Julius

From: Victor Soukup soukupvg at email.uc.edu> on 1999.12.20 at 15:46:33(3967)
Les, Donna, et al:
One fact is being missed in this discussion. A few years ago during a
study of Pistia it was found that plants had somehow gotten into the Dutch
canal system and were showing up year after year. They were behaving as
annuals, blooming, producing seed which sank to the bottom and then
germinated the next year as the water temperature rose. I don't know
whether they are still there but the nub of this note is to point out that
in an area in Zone 6b or 7, such as on Long Island, Pistia might be able to
persist in a shallow stream which does not freeze solid and which can warm
up sufficiently fast in the spring. I doubt that it would ever become the
"pest" that clogs Florida waterways but I can see some reason for caution.
However, don't get me started on preferential treatment for businesses.

Vic Soukup

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