Lysichiton Americanum Query

From: SNALICE at aol.com on 1997.08.05 at 21:30:49(1016) Hello to everyone, I sent the above questions to Greg Ruckert in hopes of finding some answers to the Lysichiton seed collection I am attempting to make. Greg has no personal experience with this species, but is hoping to hear from the list too, as he will be recieving some of the seeds. He is sending me what information he has via snail mail, and has suggested that I pose the questions to the list. I believe the Lysichiton seeds that I bagged in the field are very close to being ready to harvest, and may need immediate attention. According to information from from one source, the seeds are only viable for a short period of time. Here is the forwarding note I origianaly sent to Greg: +More >>>>>Dear Greg, I just checked on the Lysichiton infructescences the other day, and would like to ask some questions. Did you have a chance to look at the information you talked about from Roger Knutson, Professor Emeritus of Biology at Luther College in Decorah Iowa? Here's what I found at the site. The infructescences are beginning to fall to the ground, and the peduncles look like they are turning yellow at the base, which might indicate that they will soon separate from the mother plant. The fruit is still very green, not looking like ripe fruit at all, but there was one infruct. that had been torn apart (coon, or bear...I wonder what might want to eat them?) I gathered up part of it, and disected it further. There were nice large dark seeds here and there in compartments throughout the spongy substance they were locked into...I don't know how to describe that part. I took them out of their sponge and when I got home, I dropped the seeds into water and let them be, and in less than an hour they had oozed out a gelatin-like substance, (something like what Julius describes of his Urospatha seeds, another water dweller). This would indicate that if the infruct. had been exposed to water, they would be going through the process of seperating from the infruct. (and each other). They are lying on almost dry ground right now. I'm wondering if they ever do change to another color indicating ripeness, or if they might actually be ripe now. I washed some of the gelatin stuff off of the seeds, but left them in the water. What I need to find out is when they might actually ready for harvest....going both by their appearance, and by the surrounding circumstances. If they require cold weather to germinate, they may go ahead and separate now and not germinate until next spring, but if they can germinate in mild drier weather, they may be ready now. According to Proff. Knutson's notes that you mentioned earlier, the seeds are short lived, and should be ready as soon as they are ripe. The main question here is....are they ripe?<<<<< If anyone can help, it would be greatly appreciated. If anyone else would like some seeds, just let me know via my e-mail add. If there is no information on this species out there, I will do the best I can using my own judgement.......albeit not good. Thank you in advance, Sue Zunino

From: "Julius Boos" <ju-bo at msn.com> on 1997.08.06 at 02:56:40(1017) ---------- Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 1997 5:30 PM To: Julius Boos +More Subject: Lysichiton Americanum Query Dear Sue, I got your note plus this one and will give what info. I can. Unlike Dracontioides and other Aroids that I have managed to grow and produce viable seed from, Urospatha infructesences do not give an indication of being "ripe", they grow and mature to a certain stage and size over a period of months, then the spadix drops off, separating at the stipe. The seed are viable during the development of the infructesence over a long period of time, and I germinated seed from an infructesence that was broken off by accident MONTHS berore I would have guessed them to be "ready". The seeds were still light colored, and not dark and hard as in fully mature seeds, and I really had little hope of them germinating, but they did! This serves to illustrate that in at least some Aroids the seed are viable throughout a long period of their development time. I`d be concerned more about keeping them moist once you collect them. Also, try to observe what happens "naturally" in the wild. The fruit may never turn color or give an indication of being "ripe"( as in Urospatha), but when the majority of the infructesences drop off the plant, they are ready! Your cleaning method sounds good. Good luck, Sincerely, Julius ju-bo@msn.com

From: SNALICE at aol.com on 1997.08.07 at 20:11:08(1023) Subj: Re: Lysichiton Americanum Query Date: 08/05/97 To: aroid-l@mobot.org +More Thank you for that Julius. According to your information, it looks like the fruit could wait a bit longer. Most of the infructescences are still upright, so while keeping an eye on them, I will probably give them through this month and wait for more of them to follow suit. I did have a conversation this afternoon where something about "the infructescences falling apart in October" was mentioned, giving me somewhat of a time period....they couldn't really remember exactly which part of the plant the quote was referring to. So, I would say sometime between now and October something will be ready! I thank you for your response, and so does Greg, Sue PS. I had a terrible time getting that stuff off the seeds, and they still feel slimy. Will this inhibit germination?

From: "Julius Boos" <ju-bo at msn.com> on 1997.08.08 at 13:42:03(1024) ---------- Sent: Thursday, August 07, 1997 4:11 PM To: Julius Boos +More Subject: Re: Lysichiton Americanum Query Subj: Re: Lysichiton Americanum Query Date: 08/05/97 To: aroid-l@mobot.org >> Thank you for that Julius. According to your information, it looks like the fruit could wait a bit longer. Most of the infructescences are still upright, so while keeping an eye on them, I will probably give them through this month and wait for more of them to follow suit. I did have a conversation this afternoon where something about "the infructescences falling apart in October" was mentioned, giving me somewhat of a time period....they couldn't really remember exactly which part of the plant the quote was referring to. So, I would say sometime between now and October something will be ready! I thank you for your response, and so does Greg, Sue PS. I had a terrible time getting that stuff off the seeds, and they still feel slimy. Will this inhibit germination? << Dear Sue, I don`t have any personal experience with Lysichiton seeds, but will hazard a "qualified" guess that the mucilage (slimey stuff) will not adversely affect germination. One of the thoughts offered as to "why" Urospatha and other Aroids have this substance surrounding the seeds is that perhaps it may provide or attract moisture needed by the seed to germinate, much like the gel granules sold in packets at garden stores to be mixed into potting soils to "hold" moisture ( they work well for my water dwellers). Try putting the seeds in a strainer and use a strong jet of water from a tap or hose. This works for the seeds of Urospatha, Dracontioides and Dracontium, but I don`t know for Lysichiton. You will probably discover that the infructesences will fall apart or do SOMETHING in October, or whenever THEY are ready/mature. Keep us informed, and good luck. Sincerely, Julius ju-bo@msn.com

From: SNALICE at aol.com on 1997.08.09 at 02:37:30(1026) Julius and Mike, >>>>>One of the thoughts offered as to "why" Urospatha and other Aroids have this substance surrounding the seeds is that perhaps it may provide or attract moisture needed by the seed to germinate, much like the gel +More granules sold in packets at garden stores to be mixed into potting soils to "hold" moisture ( they work well for my water dwellers).<<<<< Sincerely, Julius ju-bo@msn.com >>>>> It helps the seed stay moist even when the environment around the seed dries a bit, therefore avoiding extremes of moisture content in the seed. Natures gel granules surrounding a seed :-) Mike Bordelon<<<<< This makes sense to me, because the gel wasn't there when I pulled the seed from it's sponge, but appeared only after it was exposed to water. It looked like an embryo clinging to one side of the seed, and didn't seem to encase the whole seed except for a thin layer of slime on the rest of the surface. I don't know how seeds are structured, but what might be the reason the gel sack was only attatched to one side? That's what it was, a skin with an embryo attatched! Thanks, Sue

From: "Julius Boos" <ju-bo at msn.com> on 1997.08.09 at 14:57:34(1027) Dear Sue, Since I haven`t actually seen the species in question, it is difficult to offer a suggestion as to the reason for the form of the "gel body" you have observed on the seed of Lysichiton. Any ideas from other members/lurkers would be welcomed. You may want to continue your observations on the infructesences` development under natural conditions, to try to learn what the agents of distribution are; they may be animals, birds or water. By doing so you may find a clue as to the reason for the shape/form of these structures. So little is recorded about these aspects of Aroids that it presents us with a great chance to add to the knowledge of these interesting plants. Keep up the good work. Sincerely, Julius +More ju-bo@msn.com

From: "Carlo A. Balistrieri" <cabalist at facstaff.wisc.edu> on 1997.08.10 at 02:37:01(1032) At 10:00 AM 8/9/97 -0500, you wrote: >Dear Sue, >Since I haven`t actually seen the species in question, it is difficult to >offer a suggestion as to the reason for the form of the "gel body" you have >observed on the seed of Lysichiton. Any ideas from other members/lurkers >would be welcomed. In some other species of plants (notably the genus Othonna) the gel produced by the seed is thought to be a germination inhibitor--delaying germination until the time is right. Presumably this is when the rains are sufficient to wash away the gel--and provide proper growth conditions for the seedlings that will result. Given the habitat of Lysichiton I'm not certain the explanation suffices but it's food for thought. Carlo +More Carlo A. Balistrieri, J.D. Email: CABalist@facstaff.wisc.edu P.O. Box 327 Ashippun, WI 53003-0327 U.S.A. Voice: 414.569.1902 Telefax: same number, please call ahead.

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