Determining Amorphophallus storage needs

From: aroidgrower at verizon.net (John Ludwig) on 2007.08.31 at 09:38:35(16188) I have noticed one similarity in determining a tuber's need to be stored in soil or dry. I have noticed that the tubers that need storage in soil are predominantly the ones that grow their roots from the top of the tuber. Is this a correct observation and can I apply this rule of thumb to all Amorph's? +More Are there exceptions that I am currently unaware of? I have also noticed that all of the ones that I can store dry seem to have a smooth skin that seem to be shiny\waxy in appearance. I have also weighed my tubers to see if they have been losing weight due to dessication. When a new species is discovered, How are it's needs determined?

From: hetter at xs4all.nl (Wilbert Hetterscheid) on 2007.09.01 at 10:39:54(16190) Hi John and other peoples, I cannot confirm your observation. In fact I have noticed quite the opposite. In my collection, the ones that need continuous soil and/or watering always have roots spread all over the tuber that usually are healthy when the leaf has already died down. The ones that need dry conditions and have lost their leaves, are usually also without roots or have dead or dying roots. My experience and that of others written to me, have changed my views on dormancy issues in Amorphophallus quite dramatically over the years since my publication with Ittenbach in Vol. 19 of Aroideana. Generally it seems that species from (West-)Central Africa, West Malaysia, Borneo, Java, Sumatra, S. & SE China and N. Vietnam need to be kept in soil all the time. They tend to have rather short dormancies or nearly none at all. They are from very wet areas (everwet tropical). During growth they can hardly be "overloaded" with water during watergift. Species for which this works good are: angolensis angulatus annulifer bangkokensis baumannii beccarii borneensis boyceanus brachyphyllus bufo coaetaneus costatus croatii decus-silvae discophorus dzuii eburneus eichleri elegans excentricus (is also quite drought resistant) galbra gigas glossophyllus (also quite drought resistant) hayi hetterscheidii hewittii hirsutus hottae infundibuliformis interruptus (also quite drought resistant) julaihii koratensis (when young) lambii manta myosuroides ochroleucus opertus palawanensis (can also be stored dry) pendulus prainii preussii rhizomatosus rugosus sagittarius scaber (only when young) sinuatus sparsiflorus spectabilis staudtii subpedatus tinekeae titanum tonkinensis tuberculatus venustus verticillatus zenkeri Unfortunately, this behaviour makes them the more difficult species to grow (except the ones from N. Vietnam, S. & SE China and A. hottae). The ones that have a prolongued dormancy are usually the stronger ones in cultivation and need less humid conditions. Then the smallest of species also appreciate not to be bone dry but they must also be watered carefully and not become too wet. They too tend to have hardly any appreciable dormancy and flower immediately after leaf shed or alongside mature leaves: myosuroides obscurus ongsakulii polyanthus pusillus serrulatus I think Tony Avent and Alan galloway may have plans to pubblish on this. In case the IAS board decides to reprint vol. 19, I will add a text on this subject as introduction. Of course it may be that under local circumstances at individual people's places, plants may have a deviating behaviour. But this is merely a general directive. Cheerio, Wilbert +More > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com > [mailto:aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com] Namens John Ludwig > Verzonden: vrijdag 31 augustus 2007 11:39 > Aan: Discussion of aroids > Onderwerp: [Aroid-l] Determining Amorphophallus storage needs > > > I have noticed one similarity in determining a tuber's need > to be stored in soil or dry. I have noticed that the tubers > that need storage in soil are predominantly the ones that > grow their roots from the top of the tuber. > > Is this a correct observation and can I apply this rule of > thumb to all Amorph's? > > Are there exceptions that I am currently unaware of? > > I have also noticed that all of the ones that I can store dry > seem to have a smooth skin that seem to be shiny\waxy in appearance. > > I have also weighed my tubers to see if they have been losing > weight due to dessication. > > When a new species is discovered, How are it's needs determined? > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l >

From: derek at horticulturist.com (Derek Burch) on 2007.09.01 at 16:07:22(16193) Wilbert and Tony and Alan (and any one else) - What a great topic for an article in Aroideana 31! Would this make a good "colloquium" in a series of "members' experience" articles like the one on seed and seedlings in the last issue? Derek +More -----Original Message----- From: aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com [mailto:aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com] On Behalf Of Wilbert Hetterscheid Sent: Saturday, September 01, 2007 6:40 AM To: 'Discussion of aroids' Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Determining Amorphophallus storage needs Hi John and other peoples, I cannot confirm your observation. In fact I have noticed quite the opposite. In my collection, the ones that need continuous soil and/or watering always have roots spread all over the tuber that usually are healthy when the leaf has already died down. The ones that need dry conditions and have lost their leaves, are usually also without roots or have dead or dying roots. My experience and that of others written to me, have changed my views on dormancy issues in Amorphophallus quite dramatically over the years since my publication with Ittenbach in Vol. 19 of Aroideana. Generally it seems that species from (West-)Central Africa, West Malaysia, Borneo, Java, Sumatra, S. & SE China and N. Vietnam need to be kept in soil all the time. They tend to have rather short dormancies or nearly none at all. They are from very wet areas (everwet tropical). During growth they can hardly be "overloaded" with water during watergift. Species for which this works good are: angolensis angulatus annulifer bangkokensis baumannii beccarii borneensis boyceanus brachyphyllus bufo coaetaneus costatus croatii decus-silvae discophorus dzuii eburneus eichleri elegans excentricus (is also quite drought resistant) galbra gigas glossophyllus (also quite drought resistant) hayi hetterscheidii hewittii hirsutus hottae infundibuliformis interruptus (also quite drought resistant) julaihii koratensis (when young) lambii manta myosuroides ochroleucus opertus palawanensis (can also be stored dry) pendulus prainii preussii rhizomatosus rugosus sagittarius scaber (only when young) sinuatus sparsiflorus spectabilis staudtii subpedatus tinekeae titanum tonkinensis tuberculatus venustus verticillatus zenkeri Unfortunately, this behaviour makes them the more difficult species to grow (except the ones from N. Vietnam, S. & SE China and A. hottae). The ones that have a prolongued dormancy are usually the stronger ones in cultivation and need less humid conditions. Then the smallest of species also appreciate not to be bone dry but they must also be watered carefully and not become too wet. They too tend to have hardly any appreciable dormancy and flower immediately after leaf shed or alongside mature leaves: myosuroides obscurus ongsakulii polyanthus pusillus serrulatus I think Tony Avent and Alan galloway may have plans to pubblish on this. In case the IAS board decides to reprint vol. 19, I will add a text on this subject as introduction. Of course it may be that under local circumstances at individual people's places, plants may have a deviating behaviour. But this is merely a general directive. Cheerio, Wilbert > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com > [mailto:aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com] Namens John Ludwig > Verzonden: vrijdag 31 augustus 2007 11:39 > Aan: Discussion of aroids > Onderwerp: [Aroid-l] Determining Amorphophallus storage needs > > > I have noticed one similarity in determining a tuber's need > to be stored in soil or dry. I have noticed that the tubers > that need storage in soil are predominantly the ones that > grow their roots from the top of the tuber. > > Is this a correct observation and can I apply this rule of > thumb to all Amorph's? > > Are there exceptions that I am currently unaware of? > > I have also noticed that all of the ones that I can store dry > seem to have a smooth skin that seem to be shiny\waxy in appearance. > > I have also weighed my tubers to see if they have been losing > weight due to dessication. > > When a new species is discovered, How are it's needs determined? > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l > _______________________________________________ Aroid-L mailing list Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l

From: aroidgrower at gmail.com (John Ludwig) on 2007.09.01 at 17:57:45(16194) Thank you Wilbert, Thank you wilbert for clearing this up for me. I know now that I should be thinking differently on this matter. It is obvious to me now that I need to get a reprint of Vol. 19 as reference. I look forward to any published works of Mr. Avent and Mr. Galloway on this topic. Regards, John +More On 9/1/07, Wilbert Hetterscheid wrote: > Hi John and other peoples, > > I cannot confirm your observation. In fact I have noticed quite the > opposite. In my collection, the ones that need continuous soil and/or > watering always have roots spread all over the tuber that usually are > healthy when the leaf has already died down. The ones that need dry > conditions and have lost their leaves, are usually also without roots or > have dead or dying roots. > > My experience and that of others written to me, have changed my views on > dormancy issues in Amorphophallus quite dramatically over the years since my > publication with Ittenbach in Vol. 19 of Aroideana. > > Generally it seems that species from (West-)Central Africa, West Malaysia, > Borneo, Java, Sumatra, S. & SE China and N. Vietnam need to be kept in soil > all the time. They tend to have rather short dormancies or nearly none at > all. They are from very wet areas (everwet tropical). During growth they can > hardly be "overloaded" with water during watergift. Species for which this > works good are: > > angolensis > angulatus > annulifer > bangkokensis > baumannii > beccarii > borneensis > boyceanus > brachyphyllus > bufo > coaetaneus > costatus > croatii > decus-silvae > discophorus > dzuii > eburneus > eichleri > elegans > excentricus (is also quite drought resistant) > galbra > gigas > glossophyllus (also quite drought resistant) > hayi > hetterscheidii > hewittii > hirsutus > hottae > infundibuliformis > interruptus (also quite drought resistant) > julaihii > koratensis (when young) > lambii > manta > myosuroides > ochroleucus > opertus > palawanensis (can also be stored dry) > pendulus > prainii > preussii > rhizomatosus > rugosus > sagittarius > scaber (only when young) > sinuatus > sparsiflorus > spectabilis > staudtii > subpedatus > tinekeae > titanum > tonkinensis > tuberculatus > venustus > verticillatus > zenkeri > > Unfortunately, this behaviour makes them the more difficult species to grow > (except the ones from N. Vietnam, S. & SE China and A. hottae). The ones > that have a prolongued dormancy are usually the stronger ones in cultivation > and need less humid conditions. > > Then the smallest of species also appreciate not to be bone dry but they > must also be watered carefully and not become too wet. They too tend to have > hardly any appreciable dormancy and flower immediately after leaf shed or > alongside mature leaves: > > myosuroides > obscurus > ongsakulii > polyanthus > pusillus > serrulatus > > I think Tony Avent and Alan galloway may have plans to pubblish on this. In > case the IAS board decides to reprint vol. 19, I will add a text on this > subject as introduction. > > Of course it may be that under local circumstances at individual people's > places, plants may have a deviating behaviour. But this is merely a general > directive. > > Cheerio, > Wilbert > > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > Van: aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com > > [mailto:aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com] Namens John Ludwig > > Verzonden: vrijdag 31 augustus 2007 11:39 > > Aan: Discussion of aroids > > Onderwerp: [Aroid-l] Determining Amorphophallus storage needs > > > > > > I have noticed one similarity in determining a tuber's need > > to be stored in soil or dry. I have noticed that the tubers > > that need storage in soil are predominantly the ones that > > grow their roots from the top of the tuber. > > > > Is this a correct observation and can I apply this rule of > > thumb to all Amorph's? > > > > Are there exceptions that I am currently unaware of? > > > > I have also noticed that all of the ones that I can store dry > > seem to have a smooth skin that seem to be shiny\waxy in appearance. > > > > I have also weighed my tubers to see if they have been losing > > weight due to dessication. > > > > When a new species is discovered, How are it's needs determined? > > _______________________________________________ > > Aroid-L mailing list > > Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com > > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l > > > > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l >

From: StroWi at t-online.de (StroWi at t-online.de) on 2007.09.02 at 19:06:17(16198) Dear Lord P(reservation), thanks for this very useful comments and species list! This type of information is exactly the information the desperate Amorphophile is looking for, much too often in vain..... sob, sob, sob.... +More Do you mind that I cite (copy and paste) your mail in the www.amorphophallus-forum.de? About 60 serious members and some more lurkers would be grateful, even more since some are only native speakers. ( I would ask those ones to use the babel fish for translation - alway VERY funny, however the message is generally understandable.....) Happy and successful storing, Bernhard. -----Original Message----- Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2007 12:39:54 +0200 Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Determining Amorphophallus storage needs From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" To: "'Discussion of aroids'" Hi John and other peoples, ............... Cheerio, Wilbert

From: hetter at xs4all.nl (Wilbert Hetterscheid) on 2007.09.02 at 21:02:47(16199) Hi Bernhard, Please feel free to do so. Cheero, Wilbert +More > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com > [mailto:aroid-l-bounces at gizmoworks.com] Namens StroWi at t-online.de > Verzonden: zondag 2 september 2007 21:06 > Aan: Discussion of aroids > Onderwerp: Re: [Aroid-l] Determining Amorphophallus storage needs > > Dear Lord P(reservation), > > thanks for this very useful comments and species list! > > This type of information is exactly the information the > desperate Amorphophile is looking for, much too often in > vain..... sob, sob, sob.... > > Do you mind that I cite (copy and paste) your mail in the > www.amorphophallus-forum.de? > About 60 serious members and some more lurkers would be > grateful, even more since some are only native speakers. > ( I would ask those ones to use the babel fish for > translation - alway VERY funny, however the message is > generally understandable.....) > > Happy and successful storing, > Bernhard. > > -----Original Message----- > Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2007 12:39:54 +0200 > Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Determining Amorphophallus storage needs > From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" > To: "'Discussion of aroids'" > > Hi John and other peoples, > > ............... > > Cheerio, > Wilbert > > > _______________________________________________ > Aroid-L mailing list > Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com > http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l >

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