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  amorpho titanium pollen !!!
From: "brian williams" pugturd50 at hotmail.com> on 2001.06.13 at 14:40:13(6717)
Hello! I have a friend who has a basket ball size titanium. He just got the
bulb this year and it is getting ready to bloom. I would like to know what
size flower can he expect also does anyone have some pollen to spare to see
if he can produce some seeds? If you have any instructions to help him out
would be great. I have done a few hybrids but never used frozen pollen or
know which way is the best to cut on the titanium? Cut the whole spathe off
or just a square? also when she he do the pollen? THANKS Please e mail me at
Pugturd@aol.com

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From: magrysbo at shu.edu on 2001.06.19 at 15:10:28(6756)
Brian, You're making hybrids? Great. I guess for aroids the female flowers
are receptive as soon as the spathe opens, the males wait a while and then
shed pollen which then can be used.
Good luck!
Bonaventure

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From: GeoffAroid at aol.com on 2001.06.19 at 23:44:03(6758)
In a message dated 19/6/01 11:10:48 pm, magrysbo@shu.edu writes:

<< Brian, You're making hybrids? Great. >>

I have visions of an Amorph with the vigour, hardiness and ability to divide

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" hetter at worldonline.nl> on 2001.06.20 at 08:18:03(6768)
Fainted does not even BEGIN to describe the sheer horror..........

Faintbert

----- Original Message -----

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From: magrysbo at shu.edu on 2001.06.20 at 12:50:28(6769)
Yes, imagine a paeonifolius "super-sized": or on a taller stem like that of
gigas! Howbout novel colorpatterns from breeding with albispathus?
C'mon Wilbert! Its done with Anthurium and Spathiphyllum!
Bonaventure W. Magrys
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From: "Ron Iles" roniles at eircom.net> on 2001.06.20 at 16:22:47(6774)
|
| Yes, imagine a paeonifolius "super-sized": or on a taller stem like that
of
| gigas! Howbout novel colorpatterns from breeding with albispathus?
| C'mon Wilbert! Its done with Anthurium and Spathiphyllum!
| Bonaventure W. Magrys
| Cliffwood Beach, NJ

Bonaventure!

Your mention of Spathiphyllum has brought me into this. I have Wilbert's &
friends' wonderful monograph on Amorphophallus, Even though to me they are
hellish in contrast to heavenly Peace Lilies please can I write my thoughts?

Many generations of haphazard & usually undocumented hybridisation of
Spathiphyllum has produced chaos. Spectacular "artificial" cultivars now
reign where only elegantly adapted natural species existed before. Species
evolved over the mists of time to suit their ecological niches, exactly.
Cultivars for Man's "ornament" unrelated to natural evolution & sometimes
degrading of Natural fitness. Most could not survive true competition in
the wild.

Is it to be the same history with everything when Man's curiosity leads him
to try to "improve" upon Nature. If so, then a plea to keep wild species
integrity in cultivation. Another plea objectively to document heritages &
pedigrees of all "hybrids" most carefully before allocating meaningless
"names". There is hardly a group of "domesticated" animals or plants which
Man has not tried to improve upon to the detriment & often loss of the
"wild" species. But one example dear to me is Symphysodon, "Discus",
arguably the "King" of Aquarium Fishes. Over less than three decades, the
arbitrary & mostly undocumented complex hybridisation of these supremely
specialised creatures has produced the most extreme degradation of Nature's
nobility & adapted biodiversity. All for Man's sensationalism.

There are major principles here for all those who breed wild species. Why
does one hybridise? Surely, if species have been most carefully brought
into the custody of domestic cultivation from the wild there is an
inalienable responsibilityfor Homo sapiens to honour not to trivialise
Nature?

I have tried to add humour to discussions even on plants which I can say
euphemistically are not my favourites. Sorry to be serious. I do not mean
to be a party pooper but there is a major ethic here.

Ron Iles

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From: "George R Stilwell, Jr." grsjr at juno.com> on 2001.06.20 at 17:53:56(6775)
Hear! Hear!, Ron. I'm glad someone finally said it.
Sometimes man doesn't deserve much credit.

I'll bet Lord P will agree.

Hey, that even rhymes.

Ray

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From: Piabinha at aol.com on 2001.06.20 at 20:25:03(6776)
can we cross Am. titanum with Helicodiceus and get a giant dead horse arum?

From: Paul Tyerman ptyerman at ozemail.com.au> on 2001.06.21 at 09:00:56(6782)
At 10:25 20/06/01 -0500, you wrote:
>can we cross Am. titanum with Helicodiceus and get a giant dead horse arum?
>

How about Dracunculus titanum?

Imagine something the size of the Am. titanum, but with the leaves on a
scale of titanum, but shaped as for the Drac....... surmounted by the
flower. If we're talking the same proportions........ it would be somewhat
large .

I wonder what stinky crossed with stinky would result in? Concrete melting
as teh stench was so bad?

I'll go away now.......

Cheers.

Paul Tyerman

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From: "Ron Iles" roniles at eircom.net> on 2001.06.21 at 09:01:22(6784)
Why not cross the thing with something and get a dead duck arum?

Ron

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From: "Ron Iles" roniles at eircom.net> on 2001.06.21 at 09:02:10(6787)
George!

Being a political Thesbian I love the affirmative applause. Keep it up
please. Go on, bite 'em some more!

Ron

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" hetter at worldonline.nl> on 2001.06.21 at 09:03:07(6791)
Anthurium??? Spathiphyllum??? I am offended to see that Amorphophallus is
being compared with the likes of Anthurium and Spathiphyllum. Good grief!!!!

Shockbert

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" hetter at worldonline.nl> on 2001.06.21 at 09:03:50(6794)
Errrr, I guess my message to Ron (just posted), sort of may be a shock to
some...... I'll be liberal about this (after all I AM from Holland): I think
people may hybridise whatever they want. What we should avoid, is that such
hybrids go unnoticed into cultivation. They should be properly identifibale
by a cultivar name (there is an antire nomenclature code for cultivated
plants dedicated to this issue). On the other hand, we may not want to name
every individual plant that is a one-time result of a hybridisation.....
This is actually a problematic issue, I must admit. In commercial perennial
breeding, breeders sometimes adhere to to those "interesting" looking
botanical names of their hybrids, suggesting it still IS that species,
instead of discarding of the species name and adding a cultivar name. THAT
is the wrong attitude and blurs the borderline between interest in wild
plants and interest in "nice looking plants of whatever origin".

Lord P.

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" hetter at worldonline.nl> on 2001.06.21 at 09:04:21(6796)
I think we already have the Yeti running around somewhere.....

W.

----- Original Message -----

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From: "Ron Iles" roniles at eircom.net> on 2001.06.21 at 13:11:52(6807)
I'll go away and try to sort the mess in the simple group I chose to keep.
Then scans of the defined plants can be put up on the Web for Reference.
Most cultivar "names" are illegitimate, except those direct from tissue
culture. By the time they're in "Nurseries" & Florists, they have lots of
aliases & if they cross the pond by the time they get there, forged
passports. No wonder they won't let 'em out of Countries where they're in
hiding. It seems that every Spath cultivar that ever been born has had its
original name changed by its successions of owners. In comparison, the brave
new wave of Amorphophallod miscagenators are only just beginning their
cultural diversifying. It seems even at this stage that in practice you are
surprisingly unsure of species?

R

From: "Ron Iles" roniles at eircom.net> on 2001.06.21 at 20:18:08(6818)
Wilbert!

You wrote:

There is an entire nomenclature code for cultivated

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From: magrysbo at shu.edu on 2001.06.21 at 20:18:40(6820)
Ron, tell us about Spathiphyllum crosses. Successful, ie. productive
results?
BWM

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" hetter at worldonline.nl> on 2001.06.22 at 09:04:58(6835)
Well, even in Amorphophallus there are some species very close in morphology
and even I wonder of they are rightly separated. Hybridising that stuff
would cloud the issue even more. I think I better reduce them as soon as
possible and then "hybridising" them is no fun anymore......

Wilbert

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From: "Wilbert Hetterscheid" hetter at worldonline.nl> on 2001.06.22 at 22:14:30(6841)
The full ref. is: Trehane, P, C.D. Brickell, B.R. Baum, W.L.A. Hetterscheid,
A.C. Leslie, J. McNeill, S.A. Spongberg & F. Vrugtman (eds.). International
Code of Nomenclature for Cultivated Plants -1995. Regnum Vegetabile Vol. 33.
Quarterjack Publishing, Wimborne, UK.

More info on ordering in the USA: http://www.ishs.org/sci/icracpco.htm

W.

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From: "Ron Iles" roniles at eircom.net> on 2001.06.22 at 22:15:16(6844)
Hi, Wilbert (Lord P),

Lord P

I hope my passionate ironies in writing have not been taken as disrespectful

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