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 This is a continuously updated archive of the Aroid-L mailing list in a forum format - not an actual Forum. If you want to post, you will still need to register for the Aroid-L mailing list and send your postings by e-mail for moderation in the normal way.

  Plants that glow in the dark.
From: Brian Williams pugturd at alltel.net> on 2006.09.25 at 01:49:56(14639)
At the aroid show. I was talking to Homes from Thailand about my canna
breeding. He was telling me how cannas were considered weeds in Thailand
and that they have been used in research for other plants using Gamma
rays to create mutations. Sense cannas can flower in one years time they
seem to be the best to test out. After looking this up on the internet
to see if their were any photos of these mutations. I ran across
something very interesting apparently some genetic modification was done
to a orchid using firefly genes to create the first plant that glows in
the dark. It said all parts of the plant produce light some more than
others. I found this very interesting and though it is not on the
subject of aroids I think that we may soon find aroids and other plants
being genetically modified.

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From: a san juan kalim1998 at yahoo.com> on 2006.09.25 at 04:39:09(14641)
using luciferase genes on transgenic plants is usually done for research purposes (e.g. to determine the expression of certain genes that a researcher might be studying), and this has been done for many years already - in fact, might have been a decade already. i'm surprised no one has been creating commercial plants using this until now. i'm not sure how stable the transmission of this gene would be to progenies though...Brian Williams wrote: At the aroid show. I was talking to Homes from Thailand about my canna breeding. He was telling me how cannas were considered weeds in Thailand and that they have been used in research for other plants using Gamma rays to create mutations. Sense cannas can flower in one years time they seem to be the best to test out. After looking this up on the
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From: "Frank" f_h_bln at gmx.net> on 2006.09.25 at 07:29:12(14642)
Hi all,

There is a simple reason why this technology has not been used for commercial plants: Besides some biological/technical problems, it is not allowed to keep genetically modified organisms outside a laboratory environment. As for the example of genetically engineered soya beans one has to prove that they are not harmful to humans and the environment. And My opinion is that this strict handling is absolutely necessary, otherwise we would run into an ecological catastrophy.

Best regards

Frank

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From: plantguy at zoominternet.net> on 2006.09.25 at 10:55:32(14643)
Hi Brian,

As pointed out, usng luciferase is very common and is used to study promotor
function in labs all the time. It is very common and provides an easy
readout. Of course, using things like green fluorescent protein (GFP) along
with all the other colors of the rainbow (YFP, RFP, CFP) many investigators
have created green mice, monkeys, rabbits, etc. As these are fused as
transgenes typically they are completely stable from generation to
generation and are used to study the behaviour of proteins in live
animals/cells. Rather commonplace, although I'm not usre why you would want
a glowing plant to be honest. You may remember that there were green and
red glowing zebra fish in your local pet shop a while back. These were the
resuilt of a commercial attempt to do what you are talking about except in
fish. I do not think it went over particularly well. Best of luck with
your experiments!!

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From: Kyle Baker kylefletcherbaker at yahoo.com> on 2006.09.26 at 03:02:52(14646)
This isn't meant to be political but if these folks could spend half as much time in trying to save endangered plants as they do with creating frankenstein plants we'd all be better off. would I be interested in a glow in the dark plant....probably not, would I ever buy a glow in the dark plant? never. at least no man made and not one that was a hybrid.Though I understand that the research may help mankind in someway?! is the time and money worth it at this time when there are more pressing matters at hand? Bio luminescence may be in our future, but lets not rush it. kyle fletcher baker, maine
Do you Yahoo!?
Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo! Mail._______________________________________________
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From: a san juan kalim1998 at yahoo.com> on 2006.09.26 at 03:25:18(14647)
good point...although rules governing biotech seem to be much more lax in East Asia. yep, people are scared about introducing genetically enginnered orgs into the natural environment...Frank wrote: Hi all,There is a simple reason why this technology has not been used for commercial plants: Besides some biological/technical problems, it is not allowed to keep genetically modified organisms outside a laboratory environment. As for the example of genetically engineered soya beans one has to prove that they are not harmful to humans and the environment. And My opinion is that this strict handling is absolutely necessary, otherwise we would run into an ecological catastrophy.Best regardsFrank-------- Original-Nachricht --------Datum: Sun, 24 Sep 2006 21:39:09 -0700 (PDT)Von: a
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From: Hermine hermine at endangeredspecies.com> on 2006.09.26 at 09:00:59(14649)
At 08:02 PM 9/25/2006, you wrote:

This isn't meant to be political but if these folks could spend half
as much time in trying to save endangered plants as they do with
creating frankenstein plants we'd all be better off. would I be
interested in a glow in the dark plant....probably not, would I ever
buy a glow in the dark plant? never. at least no man made and not
one that was a hybrid.

think of the money one could save on electric bills at airports. you
could line out the landing strips for night flying with
bioluminescent plants. we already have some kind of bioluminescence
in the sea, do we not? as algae. you could line city streets and save
money on electric bills that way. It is a wonderful idea! you could
also do away with the light inside the refrigerator, and find you
food at night by the glow of the vegetables therein.

hermine

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From: "Horak, David" davidhorak at bbg.org> on 2006.09.26 at 15:57:34(14654)
Title: Message

Diatribe
Warning!!!!

For a very long
time I poo pooed or at least ignored the issues of genetic manipulation
except for a minor morbid fascination with the technology and our developing
ability to do such things. Jurassic Park was entertaining reading. As time has
gone on I am beginning to realize that almost any point of view that I seem to
have is not seeing a bigger picture. Genetic manipulation sounds evil because it
is perceived as not natural. The reality is that most of the world we know is no
longer "natural". I will propose the concept that the use of genetic
technologies very well could have profound benefits for species and the
environment.

For example, working
at a botanic garden we have worked hard to minimize our use of pesticides and
fungicides and try to use the most benign solutions to manage pest issues. But,
as you all know, the reality is that plants evolve to exist in the
conditions of their native environments with specific conditions of light,
water, controlling pests and pests that control the pests, etc.. Balance. In
artificial conditions this is often not the case. The need to use chemicals to
artificially sustain balance are at times necessary. Here we can use
restraint, but in the commercial horticultural world this is often not the case.
The worst offenders statistically are the home owners and amateurs who may
purchase chemicals at the garden center or home depot that we in at the garden
are not allowed to use even if we wanted to. The profound use of chemicals in
commercial contexts is disturbing, but at least most commercial folks now will
carefully use a specific chemical targeted to a pest or pathogen because it
makes economic sense. Its expensive. However, the typical homeowner trying to
deal with their lawn or roses or trees rarely sends samples to identify a
specific pest or pathogen. Chemicals are used willy nilly in the hope the
shotgun approach will take care of the weird bug on the tomatoes. The
totals for all uses in New York State alone this is tens of thousands of
tons of chemicals. It is really frightening.

So hypothetically,
(removing the controversial application of genetically modified fruits and
vegetables from the argument) what if cultivars of popular ornamental tropicals
could be produced that are resistant to fungal diseases or specific pests, and
at the same time limited by programmed sterility? I am talking about
those millions of plants that are produced that have no chance of impacting on
native ecosystems. Even this relatively small reduction in chemicals not going
into the environment and the ground water might have tremendous
impact to the areas of south Florida and Texas alone. We are not
talking species. Think pot plant orchids and
poinsettias.

Even in the context
of fruits and vegetables. Our ability to have berries, fruits and vegetables at
any time of the year comes with the high price of the widespread and
indiscriminant use of pesticides in other parts of the world that we have banned
here. They effectively kill the pests and also kill off the pollinators for
their native plants (and probably amphibians and other things as well). My major
focus is orchids, and my friends in Ecuador increasingly comment on how the
insects are gone. There are plenty of orchids in the wild where viable, even
disturbed habitats exist, but increasingly there is little fruit set on the
plants-few if any pollinators. If protected these plants may
live for decades but these plants are now being referred to as living fossils.

If genetically
altered plants could eliminate the use of pesticides or produce grains that are
higher in protein or able to survive in drought conditions in impoverished
countries, which is the greater evil? Could genetic manipulation be a
conservation tool? Prevent cancer clusters? I certainly don't know. We might be
opening Pandora's box just a little bit more. The point is, the small step
of playing with a very identifiable characteristic such as bioluminescence could
lead to knowledge and techniques that might lead to more profound benefits.
Perhaps a Frankenstein poinsettia could save a rare aroid. Who
knows?

Dave
Horak

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From: abri1973 at wp.pl> on 2006.09.26 at 21:12:52(14657)
But.. think that plants need watering, fertilizing and lighting. So I took
this idea of a plant inside the refrigerator as a good joke.
Plants on airports - these plants can only glow, not emit strong light which
is needed on airports. You couldn't probably even read a book with that
plant.

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From: Hermine hermine at endangeredspecies.com> on 2006.09.26 at 22:39:34(14661)
At 02:12 PM 9/26/2006, you wrote:

But.. think that plants need watering, fertilizing and lighting. So
I took this idea of a plant inside the refrigerator as a good joke.

I was assuming the plants, fruit, salad vegetables and other
vegetables, would glow softly inside the fridge, so you would be able
to see the other things well enough.

Plants on airports - these plants can only glow, not emit strong
light which is needed on airports. You couldn't probably even read a
book with that plant.

Well, the pilots could wear ultra night vision glasses until we get
the plants glowing brightly enough.
once we get them lit up, we should be able to raise the level of
illumination somehow.

hermine

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From: "Susan Cox" snalice at dslextreme.com> on 2006.09.26 at 22:58:59(14662)
>>think of the money one could save on electric bills at airports. you could
line out the landing strips for night flying with bioluminescent plants. It
is a wonderful idea! you could also do away with the light inside the
refrigerator, and find you food at night by the glow of the vegetables
+More
From: Kyle Baker kylefletcherbaker at yahoo.com> on 2006.09.27 at 01:50:20(14663)
Hermine wrote: think of the money one could save on electric bills at airports. you could line out the landing strips for night flying with bioluminescent plants. we already have some kind of bioluminescence in the sea, do we not? as algae. you could line city streets and save money on electric bills that way. It is a wonderful idea! you could also do away with the light inside the refrigerator, and find you food at night by the glow of the vegetables therein.hermine well unfortunately we wouldn't save money, we'd be spending money for nothing I fear. Lining Airstrips with biolumenescent plants would be a waste as the incoming airplanes wouldn't be able to view them from so far up. True there is a type of biolumenescence naturally occuring in the sea but to
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From: HUDSONSBIRDS at webtv.net on 2006.09.27 at 15:28:47(14671)
Golly! If I eat the GLOWING veggies --Will I also GLOW-All of me!??

_______________________________________________
Aroid-l mailing list

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From: Hermine hermine at endangeredspecies.com> on 2006.09.27 at 16:55:05(14674)
At 08:28 AM 9/27/2006, you wrote:

Golly! If I eat the GLOWING veggies --Will I also GLOW-All of me!??

We are working on that.

herm

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From: Hermine hermine at endangeredspecies.com> on 2006.09.29 at 03:41:18(14701)
well unfortunately we wouldn't save money, we'd be spending money for
nothing I fear. Lining Airstrips with biolumenescent plants would be a
waste as the incoming airplanes wouldn't be able to view them from so far
up. True there is a type of biolumenescence naturally occuring in the sea
but to take that living material and play god with it just doesn't seem
right. And I'd love to see the outcome of a refrigerator that has
biolumenescence in it to light it up, infecting all foods held
within...lord knows what that'd do to our systems...lol....I'd like to
see the preservation of native plants and less hybridizations and
manipulation of plants.

Good questions and comments though, makes me think further..

kfb maine

there was a sad time when the Welsh some of them used the bodies of
rotting fish which gave off some dim light, to enable them to mine deeply
in the earth, people who did not have miners lamps.
hermine

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From: Bob Burns bobburns61 at yahoo.com> on 2006.09.29 at 17:21:52(14707)
I have not posted to this list for a long time, but do
follow it from time to time....
Does anyone else out there know about the luminous
mushrooms? There are at least two species in eastern
North America and I have seen them both. The smaller
one, Panellus stipticus, grows in clusters on oak
sticks, and I have found them clustered enough to read
by!
One might also reflect on those aroids whose
blooms give off palpable heat (Spathyema, Sauromatum,
Alocasia at least, probably lots more) These are
already converting photosynthate into infrared energy.
If we had eyes to see into that wavelength, they would
already be glowing!
Bob Burns
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