Look under species name Alocasia zebrina reticulata
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From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:42:11 -0000
Subject: No subject
Message-ID:
Plese give me informations about Anthurium Bergundi and Anthurium Black
Marie.
Regards
Mr. Sarwo
----- Pesan Asli ----
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Topik: Aroid-L Digest, Vol 43, Issue 25
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Need some advice for aroids in outdoor condition climate
zone 7 (Sheldon Hatheway)
2. Re: OT: id this non-aroid plant? (piaba)
3. Re: Need some advice for aroids in outdoor condition climate
zone 7 (RAYMOMATTLA at cs.com)
4. Re: OT: id this non-aroid plant? (mossytrail)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2008 10:46:53 -0800 (PST)
From: Sheldon Hatheway
Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Need some advice for aroids in outdoor
condition climate zone 7
To: Discussion of aroids
Message-ID: <565200.3491.qm at web39514.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hello, Franck,
Here in Canby, OR, USA, in a similar zone as yours, we successfully grow
Dracunculus vulgaris and Arum italicum (in addition to the ones you
mentioned) in the ground all year. They do just fine with a little
winter mulch if it gets below 20F. Both of these are available from
most of the larger mail-order nurseries. A Google search will give you
more leads than you could ever look at in a normal lifetime. We also
grow a number of hardy orchids outside: Bletilla, Pleione, Calanthe,
Dactylorhiza, Roscoea, Spiranthes, etc. Some of these do well in full
sun, and some appreciate a little light shade during the hot summer
afternoons.
Sheldon
----- Original Message ----
From: Franck
To: Discussion of aroids
Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2008 4:45:54 AM
Subject: [Aroid-l] Need some advice for aroids in outdoor condition
climate zone 7
Hello all,
I would like to put some aroids in outdoor condition in the garden. I
am in a climate zone 7, with hot summer and severe winter (around -10?C
in average to the lower level). What could you advice me as species ? I
have retained some ones but it is just to be sure (Arisaema sp.,
Typhonium sp., Symplocarpus sp. are the genus I have for example. I
don't write the species because the list is long). And to finish, how
or where can I found some specimens adapted in culture outdoor ?
Thanks a lot for your help
Franck
--
---------------------------------------------------
Franck RADNAI - Climate Zone 7
Web site : http://fradnai.free.fr/
Photos : http://picasaweb.google.fr/Franck54280
Long. 6?21' 7" Est
Lat. 48?47'14" Nord
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
_______________________________________________
Aroid-L
mailing
list
Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com
http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
________________________________________________________________________
____________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
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------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2008 18:08:40 -0800 (PST)
From: piaba
Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] OT: id this non-aroid plant?
To: Discussion of aroids
Message-ID: <358176.61936.qm at web51906.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
at first i thought it was a gesneriad but the leaves
totally threw me off.
=========
tsuh yang
________________________________________________________________________
____________
Looking for last minute shopping deals?
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------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2008 23:58:48 EST
From: RAYMOMATTLA at cs.com
Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] Need some advice for aroids in outdoor
condition climate zone 7
To: aroid-l at gizmoworks.com
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Franck, you could always try some of the more tropical genera like
Colocasia, Alocasia and Remusatia. All have a few species that can
overwinter
underground in zone 7. Also a few of the Amorphophallus and I even know
a few people
who over winter Philodendron bippenatifidum in zone 7. Those will
dieback to
the ground every winter but given a well drained spot will come back
with
full force in spring.
Where are you located?
Michael M.
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2008 18:05:36 -0800
From: "mossytrail"
Subject: Re: [Aroid-l] OT: id this non-aroid plant?
To: aroid-l at gizmoworks.com
Message-ID: <47c22270.2de.7d0.3383 at hctc.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> I've now found a couple of other pictures and I agree with
> Jonathan - this looks like a wonderful plant. I love
> gesneriads and this looks like one I want to grow, along
> with several others in the genus I ran across during my
> earlier searches.
>
> Steve
Speaking of Costa Rican plants from the vicinity of Arenal,
I would love to get my hands on Peperomia hernandiifolia.
I don't suppose you have any pics of AROIDS from there? I
remember some huge Xanthosoma, as in taller than I, with a
banana-like trunk. It was undescribed at the time, but I
think it may have been described by now.
Jason "hernandiifolia"(i.e., Hernandez)
Naturalist-at-Large
------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Aroid-L mailing list
Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com
http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
End of Aroid-L Digest, Vol 43, Issue 25
***************************************
_____
Bergabunglah dengan orang-orang yang berwawasan, di bidang Anda di
Yahoo!
> Answers
------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C87D1A.3863DEB0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message
class=125192715-03032008>I'm
not sure what plants you are asking about but:
class=125192715-03032008>
class=125192715-03032008> Anthurium x 'Marie' is a hybrid bird's =
nest
variety selected by Steve Nock for its beautiful maroon foliage when =
grown in
bright light. It is one which has been tissue cultured by Agristarts,
Inc.
class=125192715-03032008>
class=125192715-03032008>Anthurium 'Burgandy' as far as I know is a =
tissue
cultured flowering Anthurium andraeanum (cultorum) variety with =
dark red
spathes from Holland.
class=125192715-03032008>
class=125192715-03032008>Denis
class=125192715-03032008>Skg.com
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">Dear
every aroid lover
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">introduce
my Self...
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">My
name Mr. Sarwo.
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">From
Indonesia.
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">Plese
give me informations about Anthurium Bergundi and Anthurium Black =
Marie.
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">Regards
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">Mr.
Sarwo
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">-----
Pesan Asli ----
Dari: "aroid-l-request at gizmoworks.com"
Kepada:
aroid-l at gizmoworks.com
Terkirim: Selasa, 26 Febuari, 2008 =
1:00:02
Topik:
Aroid-L Digest, Vol 43, Issue 25
Send Aroid-L mailing list =
submissions
to
=
ymailto="mailto:aroid-l at www.gizmoworks.com">aroid-l at www.gizmoworks.com<=
/A>
To
subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, =
visit
=
target=_blank>http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
>or,
via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' =
to
=
ymailto="mailto:aroid-l-request at www.gizmoworks.com">aroid-l-request at www=
.gizmoworks.com
You
can reach the person managing the list at
href="mailto:aroid-l-owner at www.gizmoworks.com"
=
ymailto="mailto:aroid-l-owner at www.gizmoworks.com">aroid-l-owner at www.giz=
moworks.com
When
replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than =
"Re:
Contents of Aroid-L digest..."
Today's =
Topics:
1. Re:
Need some advice for aroids in outdoor condition
climate
zone 7 (Sheldon Hatheway)
2. =
Re: OT:
id this non-aroid plant? (piaba)
3. Re: Need some advice for =
aroids
in outdoor condition climate
=
zone 7
(
=
ymailto="mailto:RAYMOMATTLA at cs.com">RAYMOMATTLA at cs.com)
=
4. Re:
OT: id this non-aroid plant?
=
(mossytrail)
-------------------------------------------------=
---------------------
Message:
1
Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2008 10:46:53 -0800 (PST)
From: Sheldon =
Hatheway
<
=
ymailto="mailto:sfhatheway at yahoo.com">sfhatheway at yahoo.com>
S=
ubject:
Re: [Aroid-l] Need some advice for aroids in =
outdoor
condition climate zone 7
To: Discussion of aroids =
<
href="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com"
=
ymailto="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com">aroid-l at gizmoworks.com><=
BR>Message-ID:
<
=
ymailto="mailto:565200.3491.qm at web39514.mail.mud.yahoo.com">565200.3491=
.qm at web39514.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hello, Franck,
Here =
in Canby,
OR, USA, in a similar zone as yours, we successfully grow Dracunculus =
vulgaris
and Arum italicum (in addition to the ones you mentioned) in the =
ground all
year. They do just fine with a little winter mulch if it gets =
below
20F. Both of these are available from most of the larger =
mail-order
nurseries. A Google search will give you more leads than you =
could ever
look at in a normal lifetime. We also grow a number of hardy =
orchids
outside: Bletilla, Pleione, Calanthe, Dactylorhiza, Roscoea, =
Spiranthes,
etc. Some of these do well in full sun, and some appreciate a =
little
light shade during the hot summer =
afternoons.
Sheldon
-----
Original Message ----
From: Franck <
href="mailto:fradnai at free.fr"
ymailto="mailto:fradnai at free.fr">fradnai at free.fr>
To: =
Discussion of
aroids <
=
ymailto="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com">aroid-l at gizmoworks.com><=
BR>Sent:
Saturday, February 23, 2008 4:45:54 AM
Subject: [Aroid-l] Need some =
advice
for aroids in outdoor condition climate zone =
7
Hello all,
I would like to put some aroids =
in
outdoor condition in the garden. I
am in a climate zone 7, with hot =
summer
and severe winter (around -10?C
in average to the lower level). =
What could
you advice me as species ? I
have retained some ones but it is just =
to be
sure (Arisaema sp.,
Typhonium sp., Symplocarpus sp. are the genus I =
have
for example. I
don't write the species because the list is long). =
And to
finish, how
or where can I found some specimens adapted in culture =
outdoor
?
Thanks a lot for your help
Franck
--
---------------------------------------------------
Franck =
RADNAI -
Climate Zone 7
Web site :
target=_blank>http://fradnai.free.fr/
Photos :
href="http://picasaweb.google.fr/Franck54280"
=
target=_blank>http://picasaweb.google.fr/Franck54280
Long.&n=
bsp;
6?21' 7" Est
Lat. 48?47'14" Nord
-----Inline =
Attachment
=
Follows-----
_______________________________________________
Ar=
oid-L
mailing
list
=
ymailto="mailto:Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com">Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com<=
/A>
href="http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l"
=
target=_blank>http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
>
=
_________________________________________________________________________=
___________
Never
miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
href="http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs"
target=_blank>http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
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part
--------------
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ents/20080223/7ef5e00c/attachment-0001.html
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sat, =
23 Feb
2008 18:08:40 -0800 (PST)
From: piaba <
href="mailto:piabinha at yahoo.com"
=
ymailto="mailto:piabinha at yahoo.com">piabinha at yahoo.com>
Subje=
ct: Re:
[Aroid-l] OT: id this non-aroid plant?
To: Discussion of aroids =
<
href="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com"
=
ymailto="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com">aroid-l at gizmoworks.com><=
BR>Message-ID:
<
=
ymailto="mailto:358176.61936.qm at web51906.mail.re2.yahoo.com">358176.619=
36.qm at web51906.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
at first i thought it was a =
gesneriad
but the leaves
totally threw me =
off.
=========
tsuh
yang
=
_________________________________________________________________________=
___________
Looking
for last minute shopping deals?
Find them fast with Yahoo!
Search.
=
href="http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=s=
hopping"
=
target=_blank>http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?cate=
gory=shopping
------------------------------
Mess=
age:
3
Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2008 23:58:48 EST
From:
href="mailto:RAYMOMATTLA at cs.com"
=
ymailto="mailto:RAYMOMATTLA at cs.com">RAYMOMATTLA at cs.com
Subject: =
Re:
[Aroid-l] Need some advice for aroids in outdoor
=
condition climate zone 7
To:
href="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com"
=
ymailto="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com">aroid-l at gizmoworks.com
M=
essage-ID:
<
=
ymailto="mailto:cdc.2317f0dd.34f25388 at cs.com">cdc.2317f0dd.34f25388 at cs.=
com>
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Franck, you could always =
try some
of the more tropical genera like
Colocasia, Alocasia and =
Remusatia.
All have a few species that can overwinter
underground in zone =
7.
Also a few of the Amorphophallus and I even know a few people
who =
over
winter Philodendron bippenatifidum in zone 7. Those will dieback =
to
the ground every winter but given a well drained spot will come =
back with
full force in spring.
Where are you =
located?
Michael
M.
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was scrubbed...
URL:
=
href="http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/private/aroid-l/attachments/200=
80223/6cdcfab6/attachment-0001.htm"
=
target=_blank>http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/private/aroid-l/attachm=
ents/20080223/6cdcfab6/attachment-0001.htm
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sun, =
24 Feb
2008 18:05:36 -0800
From: "mossytrail" <
href="mailto:mossytrail at hctc.com"
=
ymailto="mailto:mossytrail at hctc.com">mossytrail at hctc.com>
Sub=
ject:
Re: [Aroid-l] OT: id this non-aroid plant?
To:
href="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com"
=
ymailto="mailto:aroid-l at gizmoworks.com">aroid-l at gizmoworks.com
M=
essage-ID:
<
=
ymailto="mailto:47c22270.2de.7d0.3383 at hctc.com">47c22270.2de.7d0.3383 at h=
ctc.com>
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> I've now found a couple =
of other
pictures and I agree with
> Jonathan - this looks like a =
wonderful
plant. I love
> gesneriads and this looks like one I want =
to grow,
along
> with several others in the genus I ran across =
during
my
> earlier searches.
>
> Steve
Speaking =
of Costa
Rican plants from the vicinity of Arenal,
I would love to get my =
hands on
Peperomia hernandiifolia.
I don't suppose you have any pics of =
AROIDS
from there? I
remember some huge Xanthosoma, as in taller =
than I,
with a
banana-like trunk. It was undescribed at the time, but =
I
think it may have been described by now.
Jason
"hernandiifolia"(i.e.,
=
Hernandez)
Naturalist-at-Large
----------------------------=
--
_______________________________________________
Aroid-L
mailing list
=
ymailto="mailto:Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com">Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com<=
/A>
href="http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l"
=
target=_blank>http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
>
End
of Aroid-L Digest, Vol 43, Issue
25
***************************************
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, =
times, serif">
Bergabunglah dengan orang-orang yang =
berwawasan, di
bidang Anda di
=
href="http://sg.rd.yahoo.com/mail/id/footer/def/*http://id.answers.yaho=
o.com/">Yahoo!
Answers
------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C87D1A.3863DEB0--
From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:42:11 -0000
Subject: No subject
Message-ID:
have Arum dioscoridis.
Alan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vincenzo Rubino"
To:
Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2008 12:31 PM
Subject: [Aroid-l] Arum Id
> Here's a picture of an unidientified Arum of mine (can't recall when I
> got it, nor who sent it to me), can it be A. palaestinum? I named it
> purpureospathum as the pot was used for this specie also, but evidently
> it is not the same thing.
>
> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v283/Dr.Palmito/Arumpurpureospathum.jpg
>
> Any guess?
> Please help, thanks.
> Vincenzo
> _______________________________________________
> Aroid-L mailing list
> Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com
> http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
>
From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:42:11 -0000
Subject: No subject
Message-ID:
When I buy Cryptocorynes in a shop they have very long petioles
but in my well ligtened aquarium they become very short
http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/walkeri.htm
http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/wendjahn.htm
http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/wendkraut.htm
Marek
----- Original Message -----
From: ted.held at us.henkel.com
To: Discussion of aroids
Sent: Friday, March 14, 2008 7:39 PM
Subject: [Aroid-l] Phototropism
Dear List,
As many of you know, from time to time I come across a botanical =
thought that perplexes me. Today's thought concerns phototropism, that =
stalwart of Botany 101 students worldwide. The aroids I grow =
(Cryptocoryne) often have very elongated, rather weak petioles. When =
growing in crowds (their typical habit) the crisscrossing petioles and =
leaves make for a veritable swarm of vegetation floating on water =
surfaces. Among this leafy mess is considerable movement on the time =
order of days. A time-lapse movie of a patch of Crypt leaves would be a =
seething turmoil. It is only because of our own time sense that plants =
seem to be passive, quiescent beings.
I assume that much or most of this movement pertains to the struggle =
for light. A new leaf emerges and starts to shade out some existing =
ones, which then bend and turn to avoid the dreaded shade. I figure this =
is a manifestation of positive phototropism, the leaves seeking to =
maximize their uptake of light energy. Fine.
Every once in a while I have to manage the plants and I can never seem =
to get all the leaves back in a situation where the upper surfaces are =
happily pointed to the sky. Some leaves always get turned over because =
the petioles are soft and can twist, exposing the underside of the leaf =
to the sky and the incoming light. While you can see that the plants =
attempt, in their way, to get the leaf turned back the right way, often =
this is not possible. Even though the leaf is bathed in light, this =
light is shining onto what is anatomically the underside and the plants =
do not like it this way. If the leaf does not get turned back upright, =
it dies. Why is that?
My first theory is that it has something to do with stomata, those =
little openings with which plants maintain their air/moisture balance. =
Everybody from Botany 101 knows that the bottom side of the leaf is =
where the lion's share of these gizmos lie. If the underside is exposed =
to the sun and weather the leaf gets off-kilter and the plant shuts it =
down. That's a pretty good theory even if we are dealing here with =
aquatic plants where the relative humidity (at least in my setup) is =
100%.
My second theory is that the photosynthetic apparatus in plants is =
directional, meaning that reception of photons for photosynthesis is a =
one-way mechanism. By this theory photons coming in through the =
backside, as it were, are not efficiently captured, basically rendering =
it the same as if that leaf were in the dark. A leaf in the dark is a =
wasted leaf, so the plant gives orders to withdraw the sap-soluble =
goodies and abandon that leaf in favor of producing a new one that can =
orient itself properly.
Any ideas from the botanists?
Ted.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----
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Aroid-L mailing list
Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com
http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/listinfo/aroid-l
__________ NOD32 Informacje 2947 (20080314) __________
Wiadomosc zostala sprawdzona przez System Antywirusowy NOD32
http://www.nod32.com lub http://www.nod32.pl
------=_NextPart_000_00F7_01C88614.3DF9D430
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello,
From my =
experience.
When I buy =
Cryptocorynes in a shop
they have very long petioles
but in my well ligtened =
aquarium they
become very short
href="http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/walkeri.htm"=
>http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/walkeri.htm
NT>
href="http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/wendjahn.htm=
">http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/wendjahn.htm
FONT>
href="http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/wendkraut.ht=
m">http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/wendkraut.htm=
Marek
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
----- Original Message -----
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black">From:
href="mailto:ted.held at us.henkel.com">ted.held at us.henkel.com =
Sent: Friday, March 14, 2008 =
7:39
PM
Subject: [Aroid-l] =
Phototropism
Dear List,
As many of you know, from =
time to time I
come across a botanical thought that perplexes me. Today's thought =
concerns
phototropism, that stalwart of Botany 101 students worldwide. The =
aroids I
grow (Cryptocoryne) often have very elongated, rather weak petioles. =
When
growing in crowds (their typical habit) the crisscrossing petioles and =
leaves
make for a veritable swarm of vegetation floating on water surfaces. =
Among
this leafy mess is considerable movement on the time order of days. A
time-lapse movie of a patch of Crypt leaves would be a seething =
turmoil. It is
only because of our own time sense that plants seem to be passive, =
quiescent
beings.
I assume that =
much or most
of this movement pertains to the struggle for light. A new leaf =
emerges and
starts to shade out some existing ones, which then bend and turn to =
avoid the
dreaded shade. I figure this is a manifestation of positive =
phototropism, the
leaves seeking to maximize their uptake of light energy. Fine.
Every once in a while I have =
to manage
the plants and I can never seem to get all the leaves back in a =
situation
where the upper surfaces are happily pointed to the sky. Some leaves =
always
get turned over because the petioles are soft and can twist, exposing =
the
underside of the leaf to the sky and the incoming light. While you can =
see
that the plants attempt, in their way, to get the leaf turned back the =
right
way, often this is not possible. Even though the leaf is bathed in =
light, this
light is shining onto what is anatomically the underside and the =
plants do not
like it this way. If the leaf does not get turned back upright, it =
dies. Why
is that?
My first =
theory is that
it has something to do with stomata, those little openings with which =
plants
maintain their air/moisture balance. Everybody from Botany 101 knows =
that the
bottom side of the leaf is where the lion's share of these gizmos lie. =
If the
underside is exposed to the sun and weather the leaf gets off-kilter =
and the
plant shuts it down. That's a pretty good theory even if we are =
dealing here
with aquatic plants where the relative humidity (at least in my setup) =
is
100%.
My second theory =
is that the
photosynthetic apparatus in plants is directional, meaning that =
reception of
photons for photosynthesis is a one-way mechanism. By this theory =
photons
coming in through the backside, as it were, are not efficiently =
captured,
basically rendering it the same as if that leaf were in the dark. A =
leaf in
the dark is a wasted leaf, so the plant gives orders to withdraw the
sap-soluble goodies and abandon that leaf in favor of producing a new =
one that
can orient itself properly.
size=2>Any
ideas from the botanists?
size=2>Ted.
_______________________________________________
Aroid-L =
mailing
=
list
Aroid-L at www.gizmoworks.com
http://www.gizmoworks.com/mailman/l=
istinfo/aroid-l
__________
NOD32 Informacje 2947 (20080314) __________
Wiadomosc zostala
sprawdzona przez System Antywirusowy NOD32
http://www.nod32.com lub =
http://www.nod32.pl
------=_NextPart_000_00F7_01C88614.3DF9D430--
From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:42:11 -0000
Subject: No subject
Message-ID:
When I buy Cryptocorynes in a shop they have very long petioles
but in my well ligtened aquarium they become very short
This is a different sort of phenomenon than what I am speaking about.
Some, perhaps most species in this genus do become very different in leaf
morphology when grown under different lighting and planting conditions.
The again, sometimes just the opposite happens; the leaves and petioles
elongate from what you buy at the store or at an auction. In general,
however, Crypt leaves tend to look more like your "before" pictures. My
bet is that those had been growing emerse (with leaves into atmosphere),
while yours look submerged. That alone is enough to account for how
different they look now.
If you look at the right-hand picture of the newly-purchased plants on
your site (the ones in the mesh baskets)
http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/wendjahn.htm
you will see the sort of situation that can lead to a "flip-over". If that
plant were planted in a shallow-immersed situation, where the leaves tend
to splay across the water surface, that middle leaf could well end up with
its underside exposed to the sky. We are not speaking here of an event
where the petiole has folded, kinked, or twisted. Those conditions would
obviously result in a physical problem for the conduction of sap
containing soluble foodstuffs that could well lead to the plant
sacrificing that leaf. But because the petioles tend to be rather flexible
in this genus, the chances of ending up with an inverted leaf are good.
Judging from the lack of responses I am thinking that the list does not
know the answer. If I think of all the leaves I have ever seen, unless a
plant has suffered damage, all the leaves want to be more or less
horizontal. There is an upper leaf surface and a lower leaf surface. The
upper leaf surface may have a thicker skin, perhaps with a waxy coating,
or a darker color to deal with the stress of being in direct light and
more exposed to the elements. The underside is specialized by having
gas-transport structures, perhaps hairy features, and who knows what else.
The leaf may be exactly horizontal or may prefer to orient itself at some
angle (up or down from horizontal). Or it may even change as the leaf
matures. But this presentation to the world is a characteristic of the
plant. And it is always directional in higher plants. Algae and such may
be different.
At the same time leaves are typically translucent. This means that if you
place a leaf between you and a light source you can detect the light
coming right through the tissue. To be sure, some wavelengths have been
filtered out, which is why the leaf looks green (or reddish, or brownish,
etc.). But the same sort of filter is in place if you look through the
other leaf surface. It still looks green, meaning that light has been
gathered and filtered. Is light coming up through the leaf underside
useful for photosynthesis? If not, why not?
Don't think I'm pressuring anyone for answers. These are just the
questions I throw out because they bug me. There are many unexplained
phenomena in the world. Sometimes I think there are more mysteries than
there are answers. I am curious.
Ted.
--=_alternative 0058420985257410_=
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Dear Marek,
Your comment:
From my experience.
When I buy Cryptocorynes in a shop they have
very long petioles
but in my well ligtened aquarium they become
very short
This is a different sort of phenomenon
than what I am speaking about. Some, perhaps most species in this genus
do become very different in leaf morphology when grown under different
lighting and planting conditions. The again, sometimes just the opposite
happens; the leaves and petioles elongate from what you buy at the store
or at an auction. In general, however, Crypt leaves tend to look more like
your "before" pictures. My bet is that those had been growing
emerse (with leaves into atmosphere), while yours look submerged. That
alone is enough to account for how different they look now.
If you look at the right-hand picture
of the newly-purchased plants on your site (the ones in the mesh baskets)
http://www.wschowa.com/abrimaal/araceum/cryptocoryne/wendjahn.htm
you will see the sort of situation that
can lead to a "flip-over". If that plant were planted in a shallow-immersed
situation, where the leaves tend to splay across the water surface, that
middle leaf could well end up with its underside exposed to the sky. We
are not speaking here of an event where the petiole has folded, kinked,
or twisted. Those conditions would obviously result in a physical problem
for the conduction of sap containing soluble foodstuffs that could well
lead to the plant sacrificing that leaf. But because the petioles tend
to be rather flexible in this genus, the chances of ending up with an inverted
leaf are good.
Judging from the lack of responses I
am thinking that the list does not know the answer. If I think of all the
leaves I have ever seen, unless a plant has suffered damage, all the leaves
want to be more or less horizontal. There is an upper leaf surface and
a lower leaf surface. The upper leaf surface may have a thicker skin, perhaps
with a waxy coating, or a darker color to deal with the stress of being
in direct light and more exposed to the elements. The underside is specialized
by having gas-transport structures, perhaps hairy features, and who knows
what else. The leaf may be exactly horizontal or may prefer to orient itself
at some angle (up or down from horizontal). Or it may even change as the
leaf matures. But this presentation to the world is a characteristic of
the plant. And it is always directional in higher plants. Algae and such
may be different.
At the same time leaves are typically
translucent. This means that if you place a leaf between you and a light
source you can detect the light coming right through the tissue. To be
sure, some wavelengths have been filtered out, which is why the leaf looks
green (or reddish, or brownish, etc.). But the same sort of filter is in
place if you look through the other leaf surface. It still looks green,
meaning that light has been gathered and filtered. Is light coming up through
the leaf underside useful for photosynthesis? If not, why not?
Don't think I'm pressuring anyone for
answers. These are just the questions I throw out because they bug me.
There are many unexplained phenomena in the world. Sometimes I think there
are more mysteries than there are answers. I am curious.
Ted.
--=_alternative 0058420985257410_=--
From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:42:11 -0000
Subject: No subject
Message-ID:
strength of GA3 to use, or application. This is the same situation with
several other growth hormones (including the famous 2-4 D, used as a broad-leaf
weed killer) that you see discussed in the casual press.
For Crypts, at least, I think flowering
is not obligatory and may even be degenerate in some forms. But there is
certainly a set of conditions that kick a plant into flowering and others
that make it passive. It would be of great interest scientifically (and
to horticulturists) to know what these conditions are.
I don't use my GA3 anymore.
Ted.
--=_alternative 006C423885257418_=--
From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:42:11 -0000
Subject: No subject
Message-ID:
Here is a link that might be useful: =
http://www.pompousasswords.com/www/index.htm
YOU ARE SUCH AN =
IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!=
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The people you so =
religiously quote are ashamed to be associated with you. Yes! It's =
true! Emails are flying behind your back! You are the absolute shame =
of the UBC horticultural site. NO ONE wants to be associated with you =
but out of pity they endure your presence. STOP GRANDSTANDING. CAN YOU =
NOT HEAR THE LAUGHTER??????????????????
Again, my apologies if I have offended anyone on Aroid l. It was =
certainly not intended.
Steve Lucas
www.ExoticRainforest.com
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charset="Windows-1252"
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To everyone on Aroid l,
If any apology for some of my comments or questions =
on Aroid l
is in order, I gladly offer it.
I received a very disturbing message tonight with a =
direct
copy (slightly edited) that I posted on this forum about my construction =
of my
epiphyte tree. The message came from a person whose name showed up =
as Holly Cooper. I do not know Holly but she has posted a =
similar
message once before on the GardenWeb. In that case, another =
individual had
requested a photo of Anthurium cubense. I had taken a =
photo of
Denis' plant which was tagged Anthurium cubense with Leland =
Miyano
standing with it at the 2007 IAS Aroid Show. As it turned out, =
Leland
later pointed out the vein count on that plant did not match Dr. Croat's =
scientific description so we learned later that plant is not a full =
species and
liekly a hybrid. The moderators of the GardenWeb forum took down
her post since it referred to me by a strong term.
If I have irritated any of you with my constant =
comments and
questions, I sincerely apologize. I am only a student of aroid =
botany and
constantly ask questions in order to learn. I don't believe anyone =
can
find any place on my website or on the net where I have ever claimed to =
be an
expert in plants. I just study them, ask a lot of questions of Dr. =
Croat,
Leland and Julius and I probably read too much. The only =
aroid
experts I know are the ones I try to accurately quote in my internet
articles.
This is what I received from Ms. Cooper. I =
have
purposely removed her email address:
From Holly Cooper:
Here is a link that might be useful:
href="http://www.pompousasswords.com/www/index.htm">http://www.pomp=
ousasswords.com/www/index.htm
YOU ARE SUCH AN
IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!=
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The people you so religiously quote are ashamed to be associated with =
you.
Yes! It's true! Emails are flying behind your back! =
You are
the absolute shame of the UBC horticultural site. NO ONE wants to =
be
associated with you but out of pity they endure your presence. =
STOP
GRANDSTANDING. CAN YOU NOT HEAR THE =
LAUGHTER??????????????????
Again, my apologies if I have offended anyone on =
Aroid
l. It was certainly not intended.
Steve Lucas
href="http://www.ExoticRainforest.com">www.ExoticRainforest.com
NT>
------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C8C379.E2B019B0--
From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:42:11 -0000
Subject: No subject
Message-ID:
Here is a link that might be useful: http://www.pompousasswords.com/www/index.htm
YOU ARE SUCH AN IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The people you so religiously quote are ashamed to be associated with you. Yes! It's true! Emails are flying behind your back! You are the absolute shame of the UBC horticultural site. NO ONE wants to be associated with you but out of pity they endure your presence. STOP GRANDSTANDING. CAN YOU NOT HEAR THE LAUGHTER??????????????????
Again, my apologies if I have offended anyone on Aroid l. It was certainly not intended.
Steve Lucas
www.ExoticRainforest.com
--NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_4981_1212348915_0
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I do not often write in, because I am a rank amateur with Aroids. I do not know you or that nasty woman who wrote that email to the site. I think someone with such a lack of character should be severely chastised. Ron
-------------- Original message from "ExoticRainforest" : --------------
To everyone on Aroid l,
If any apology for some of my comments or questions on Aroid l is in order, I gladly offer it.
I received a very disturbing message tonight with a direct copy (slightly edited) that I posted on this forum about my construction of my epiphyte tree. The message came from a person whose name showed up as Holly Cooper. I do not know Holly but she has posted a similar message once before on the GardenWeb. In that case, another individual had requested a photo of Anthurium cubense. I had taken a photo of Denis' plant which was tagged Anthurium cubense with Leland Miyano standing with it at the 2007 IAS Aroid Show. As it turned out, Leland later pointed out the vein count on that plant did not match Dr. Croat's scientific description so we learned later that plant is not a full species and liekly a hybrid. The moderators of the GardenWeb forum took down her post since it referred to me by a strong term.
If I have irritated any of you with my constant comments and questions, I sincerely apologize. I am only a student of aroid botany and constantly ask questions in order to learn. I don't believe anyone can find any place on my website or on the net where I have ever claimed to be an expert in plants. I just study them, ask a lot of questions of Dr. Croat, Leland and Julius and I probably read too much. The only aroid experts I know are the ones I try to accurately quote in my internet articles.
This is what I received from Ms. Cooper. I have purposely removed her email address:
From Holly Cooper:
YOU ARE SUCH AN IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The people you so religiously quote are ashamed to be associated with you. Yes! It's true! Emails are flying behind your back! You are the absolute shame of the UBC horticultural site. NO ONE wants to be associated with you but out of pity they endure your presence. STOP GRANDSTANDING. CAN YOU NOT HEAR THE LAUGHTER??????????????????
Again, my apologies if I have offended anyone on Aroid l. It was certainly not intended.
Steve Lucas
--NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_4981_1212348915_1--
--NextPart_Webmail_9m3u9jl4l_4981_1212348915_0--
From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 03:42:11 -0000
Subject: No subject
Message-ID:
Here is a link that might be useful:
http://www.pompousasswords.com/www/index.htm
YOU ARE SUCH AN
IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!=
!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The people you so religiously
quote are ashamed to be associated with you. Yes! It's true! Emails =
are
flying behind your back! You are the absolute shame of the UBC
horticultural site. NO ONE wants to be associated with you but out of =
pity
they endure your presence. STOP GRANDSTANDING. CAN YOU NOT HEAR THE
LAUGHTER??????????????????
Again, my apologies if I have offended anyone on Aroid l. It was =
certainly
not intended.
Steve Lucas
www.ExoticRainforest.com
------=_NextPart_000_006C_01C8C424.2BA99560
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="windows-1258"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" =
xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" =
xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" =
xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
You gotta be =
kidding!!!!
style='color:#1F497D'>
I am certainly not =
laughing or
pitying you. You are asking great questions, often the same questions =
that
others have, and sometimes the questions people want to ask but do not =
know
how. Steve, I am not in any way ashamed to be associated with you. I am =
proud
to be of your acquaintance, as a member of the IAS, and a part of the =
Aroid-L.
style='color:#1F497D'>
It is true that in a =
public
forum, one can always be found who will be offended. But you do a =
service to
aroiders everywhere. You should be thanked, not =
maligned.
style='color:#1F497D'>
Best =
always,
style='color:#1F497D'>Christopher
style='color:#1F497D'>
style='color:#1F497D'>
D. Christopher =
Rogers
Senior Invertebrate =
Ecologist/
Taxono | 
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